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-   -   Do I try again!? (http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/juddd/748075-do-i-try-again.html)

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 02:23 PM

Do I try again!?
 
Hey JUDDD buddds....

Here is my story. You all know I tried JUDDD a while back. I seemed to have amazing success in the first week...then I hit TOM...and everything stopped. I gained (instantly) everything I'd lost and could not lose it again, no matter how strict my DDs were, even after TOM went away.

I got frustrated and stopped. I was also really having problems (mental LOL) ingesting carbs. I could not reconcile carbs with health, since as a diabetic, I know that every carb I eat forces my pancreas to make insulin and can contribute to burning out my remaining beta cells.

But I am still stalled and still frustrated. Have you ever heard of anything like this happening to someone who does JUDDD?

I don't really know what to do with myself right now. I am super depressed about my stall (I have tried SO MANY things to get over it...it makes me just want to cry!).

I don't know if I want to try JUDDD again but everything I read about breaking a stall recommends calorie cycling. Here is the deal...if you do JUDDD low carb (or lower carb) how can you possibly eat anything at all on a DD?

I also cannot get a lot of the 'ingredients' other JUDDDers use for DD foods, since I live in Europe and things like Gluc powder and oat fiber are IMPOSSIBLE to get.

So yeah...I guess...any ideas about how one would (if I went back to calorie cycling) do a low carb DD with SIMPLE foods?

Thanks for helping. I just don't know where to go from here...

mayleesa 12-05-2011 02:29 PM

for down days my salads are very lowcarb...and chicken broth with celery for most dinners...eggs i hear are popular with spray butter so your not eating all the calories of real butter...i'm WAY sure others will chime in!

MintQ8 12-05-2011 02:30 PM

Hi Stardust Shadow - hope you're good!!!

Have to admit to using the shirataki noodles here in the UK - but nothing else 'special'. Although they're really useful - you could make something similar with long grated courgette/zucchini - or with green beans??

There are others looking at doing this LC - have a look at the threads they have started.

Good luck!!

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 02:36 PM

I CAN get shiritaki noodles:) Probably the *ONE* specialty item I don't have problems getting:)
Nice to see you again Mint:) Hope you are well, too!

FremenChick 12-05-2011 02:38 PM

How long has been your stall?

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FremenChick (Post 15227034)
How long has been your stall?

Ages. I haven't really lost anything since...april or may?

dasiey 12-05-2011 02:57 PM

You can always have egg drop soup
chicken is low cal. skin off.
egg beaters
laughing cow cheese Light
cottage cheese (ff)

Beeb 12-05-2011 03:16 PM

Oh Star, if I could send you a box of JUDDD goodies I would in a :heart:beat!

The best I can offer is a :console: and a suggestion that you look up on line low calorie recipes and see what you can make from what you have in your area of the world.

I don't know what else to suggest, but hope you find something to help really soon! :hugs::console:

pjsam1156 12-05-2011 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stardustshadow (Post 15227043)
Ages. I haven't really lost anything since...april or may?

Stardust, besides my recommendations of low carb DDs staples of any kind of omelets and huge salads w/low cal dressing:yummy:, are you keeping track of UD cals? I was stalled for three weeks because I wasn't counting UD cals and was eating WAYYYY over my UD limit.:laugh:

There are so many "experts" in here:love:, hopefully someone will have the answer for you. Keep checking this thread and try what they suggest. GOOD LUCK!!:clap:

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjsam1156 (Post 15227135)
Stardust, besides my recommendations of low carb DDs staples of any kind of omelets and huge salads w/low cal dressing:yummy:, are you keeping track of UD cals? I was stalled for three weeks because I wasn't counting UD cals and was eating WAYYYY over my UD limit.:laugh:

There are so many "experts" in here:love:, hopefully someone will have the answer for you. Keep checking this thread and try what they suggest. GOOD LUCK!!:clap:

That is a good question...I thought that I was, but there were some days that I may have gone over (because that day it was impossible to track due to various reasons). I didn't continue after two weeks because I got so frustrated...took a break from JUDDD. But other stuff isn't working for me, either. So I am trying to figure out if I should give JUDDD another go:)

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beeb (Post 15227128)
Oh Star, if I could send you a box of JUDDD goodies I would in a :heart:beat!

The best I can offer is a :console: and a suggestion that you look up on line low calorie recipes and see what you can make from what you have in your area of the world.

I don't know what else to suggest, but hope you find something to help really soon! :hugs::console:

Thanks Beeb:)

handbells 12-05-2011 03:25 PM

A lot of people do well with minimal eating on DD's. It's more important to eat your calories on the UD's than on your DD's. Some low cal/low carb options are:

Broth
Shiritaki noodles
Eggs
Vegetables (I like to eat a big salad)
Shrimp
Crab
Boca Burger (if you can get them. Minus the fiber, they are 2 carbs/70 cal)

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 03:46 PM

Maybe I didn't give that gene time to activate...hmmm.

Beeb 12-05-2011 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stardustshadow (Post 15227145)
That is a good question...I thought that I was, but there were some days that I may have gone over (because that day it was impossible to track due to various reasons). I didn't continue after two weeks because I got so frustrated...took a break from JUDDD. But other stuff isn't working for me, either. So I am trying to figure out if I should give JUDDD another go:)

I am seeing a pattern with new JUDDDers that suggests after 2 or 3 weeks of a nice loss they tend to "stall" out. But I'm thinking it's just the bodies way of adjusting to a new way of eating and if we give it a chance, like maybe another week or so most times we will see JUDDDers reporting a whoosh or a steady loss again.

Maybe give it 3 to 4 weeks this time and see what happens? If nothing else is working maybe a longer trial period with JUDDD could do the trick?

Just a few thoughts......:console:

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beeb (Post 15227318)
I am seeing a pattern with new JUDDDers that suggests after 2 or 3 weeks of a nice loss they tend to "stall" out. But I'm thinking it's just the bodies way of adjusting to a new way of eating and if we give it a chance, like maybe another week or so most times we will see JUDDDers reporting a whoosh or a steady loss again.

Maybe give it 3 to 4 weeks this time and see what happens? If nothing else is working maybe a longer trial period with JUDDD could do the trick?

Just a few thoughts......:console:

Well that is really good to know! I was wondering if I was the only one or if there was a pattern!:)

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beeb (Post 15227318)
I am seeing a pattern with new JUDDDers that suggests after 2 or 3 weeks of a nice loss they tend to "stall" out. But I'm thinking it's just the bodies way of adjusting to a new way of eating and if we give it a chance, like maybe another week or so most times we will see JUDDDers reporting a whoosh or a steady loss again.

Maybe give it 3 to 4 weeks this time and see what happens? If nothing else is working maybe a longer trial period with JUDDD could do the trick?

Just a few thoughts......:console:

I am very much considering giving it another go! It can't hurt:)

mattsmama 12-05-2011 04:13 PM

Since you have been stalled for a while now, would you be willing to give it a little longer? I would love to see you have what you want. Maybe just throw caution to the wind a little? Not go crazy, but tell yourself that since you've been stalled for a few months, you OWE it to yourself to give this a good little go.
Just think of what you would tell your best friend in your situation, and then follow your own advice. Many times we are kinder to those we love than to ourselves.

Much luck to you on your journey!! :hugs:

dasiey 12-05-2011 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stardustshadow (Post 15227145)
That is a good question...I thought that I was, but there were some days that I may have gone over (because that day it was impossible to track due to various reasons). I didn't continue after two weeks because I got so frustrated...took a break from JUDDD. But other stuff isn't working for me, either. So I am trying to figure out if I should give JUDDD another go:)

why not try again. I did and I was stalled afor over a year. And I lost 9 pounds in 2 weeks.

stardustshadow 12-05-2011 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dasiey (Post 15227343)
why not try again. I did and I was stalled afor over a year. And I lost 9 pounds in 2 weeks.

Goodness well that is encouraging:)

leonak 12-05-2011 05:13 PM

Hi Star!

You have really nothing to lose by trying JUDD again! It does work for many of us, for me it is going very slow! But it is working!!!!

My g/m also was diabetic and I remember her having fruit, can you also have fruit?

On my DD I have yogurt and coffee for breakfast, lunch is a protein, a hot veggie and a salad, my dinner is usually only fruit, but sometimes I add an egg or cheese if I have the calories left.

Good Luck To You!

melissaconatser 12-05-2011 05:37 PM

I read someone the other day talking about having steak-ums on their DD with laughing cow cheese. I bought some over the weekend and today for lunch I sauteed (in Pam spray) a TBL or so of diced onion and green pepper. I added in my steak (which is 100 calories per portion) and then added in the wedge of cheese. So, for a little less than 150 calories, I had the most filling meal I have ever had on a DD.

So, if you can get laughing cow cheese and those super thin steaks you buy frozen, then I think this would be a fantastic meal.

Speck333 12-05-2011 05:42 PM

I keep it super simple and low carb on down days. It's the only way I can do them. Breakfast is a protein & vitamin powder almond milk shake and coffee. Followed by a low carb light yogurt cup around noon to keep my bs from tanking until I can get home. Lunch is soup -- lately Progresso light but before homemade. Coffee for snack to tied me over for dinner. Dinner is a huge romaine salad with light dressing and 4 oz lean protein.
This nets out to about 25 carbs and about 600 cals depending on the dinner protein choice.

kel7298 12-05-2011 06:08 PM

After the second week, I stalled to 1lb a week for 3 weeks. Then low and behold it started to drop again. Anyway, with your plight of wanting to stay low carb, I turned into a girl with a mission.

Proteins
Meats, shellfish and poultry are low in carbohydrates, but fattier cuts of meat are high in calories. For example, 3 oz. of rib-eye steak contains almost 200 calories even though it has no carbohydrates. Three oz. of shrimp, however, have just 84 calories and no carbs. Crabmeat is also low in calories, with just 82 calories per 3 oz. and no carbohydrates. Canned tuna, packed in water, and broiled flounder both have 99 calories per 3 oz. with no carbohydrates. Egg whites are another protein source with no carbohydrates and just 16 calories per one large egg.

Vegetables
Watery green vegetables tend to contain the least carbohydrates. Arugula, spinach, romaine and bok choy contain just trace amounts of carbohydrates and only about 5 calories per cup when raw. Radishes contain 4 g of carbs and 19 calories per 1 cup. Cucumbers contain 3 g of carbohydrates and 16 calories per cup. Alfalfa sprouts have just 1 g of carbs and 8 calories per cup. Celery is also a low-carb, low-calorie snack with 3 g of carbs and 16 calories per 1 cup when chopped and raw. Vegetables that are low in carbohydrates (less than 5 grams per 1 cup serving) include leafy greens as lettuce, Brussels sprouts, endive, spinach, arugula, kale and chard. Incorporate cucumbers, celery, broccoli, cauliflower, peppers and sauerkraut into your diet as well.

Other Foods
Canned broth is low in calorie and carbohydrates. Chicken broth, for example, averages about 38 calories and 3 g of carbs. Lemon juice provides 3 g of carbs per fluid ounce with only 8 calories. While most fruits contain a significant amount of carbohydrates, three large strawberries, each measuring 1 3/8 inches across, contain 18 calories and just 3 g carbs. Lowcarbfoods.org touts watermelon, cantaloupe, apples, strawberries, blackberries and avocados as the best options, none with more than 7 grams of carbohydrates per 1/2 cup serving.

Egg White Omelets
Egg whites are low in calories and high in protein. They also do not contain carbohydrates. Scramble four egg whites with baby spinach, mushrooms and 1 oz. of Swiss cheese for about 200 calories and just 3.5 g of carbohydrates. Add a cup of raspberries to add just 30 calories and 7 g of carbohydrates. Other low-carb additions to egg whites are salsa with a slice of avocado, smoked salmon and cream cheese or diced tomatoes and feta cheese.

Ham and Cheese and Tuna Salad
Avoid spending the money and navigating restaurant menus by preparing a low-carb, low-calorie lunch at home. Make pinwheels by rolling 3 oz. of deli ham and 1 oz. of cheese in large romaine leaves and slicing for just about 200 calories and 2 g of carbs. Include an orange for just another 11 g of carbs and 60 calories. Use endive leaves to scoop up a salad made by stirring together 3 oz. water-packed tuna with 1 tbsp. of capers, lemon juice, chopped celery and 1 tbsp. of non-fat yogurt for about 5 g of carbs and 180 calories.

A Protein with Veggies
Low-carb, low-calorie dinners do not have to include a lot of preparation. Usually 3 to 4 oz. of a grilled or broiled lean protein alongside watery, fibrous vegetables will come in under 300 calories and 10 g of carbs. Purchase a rotisserie chicken and eat the breast alongside a salad made with a bag of pre-washed greens, a oz. of blue cheese and light balsamic dressing for a dinner of 250 calories and about 4 g of carbs. Bake 4 oz. of wild salmon in a 400-degree oven until cooked through and enjoy with eight asparagus spears for 250 calories and just 5 g of carbs.

SoHappy 12-05-2011 06:10 PM

Here are two things I think happen to some folks within the first few weeks when people start JUDDD, both of which can result in disappointing scale readings. And the trouble when that happens is that folks are very liable to bale and run before giving their body the time it takes to settle into this plan and get into weight loss.

1. I think the vast majority of those who come to JUDDD from a previous low carb plan increase the number of carbs in their diet.

And sometimes they have previously been eating very low carb for many, many months and even years, so you can imagine how reactive their body will have become to carbs during that prior time of deprivation from carbohydrate.

I think this is what causes their *stall*, and in many cases, I'm pretty sure they are actually losing body FAT, even though the scale is not showing it, because I think that at the same time they are regaining some water weight in their liver and muscle tissue from adding come additional carbs back in.

I believe if they waited it out, remaining true to JUDDD for awhile longer, they would witness their body normalize it's fluid weight in relation to the carbs they are now going to be including in their diet, and at that point they would be able to watch their scale weight register lower and lower as the weeks went by.

2. I think there are some folks who have been on very low carb for so long, with such little appetite every day from following that diet choice, that they have brought themselves to the point of eating very, very, very few calories almost every day. They are all low carb calories, just very few of them daily.

We do know that in the face of an ongoing long-term very low calorie diet, the body really slows down its metabolic rate. I'm not saying they have irrevocably ruined their metabolisms.. only that they may be at a place finally where their metabolism is running much slower than those online calorie calculators would predict as their *calorie number*, so it's possible that by the time they take that UD number they are given and add some DD calories to it, that could possibly be quite a few MORE calories every two days than they were previously eating on low carb. Some people really don't eat much food on their very low carb plans, and have little appetite to eat more than they do anyway.

So for those people, they may have to hold their UDs to a few hundred calories less than the generic average they were given when they first did their figures. Not that they will have to remain at that... as I think JUDDD can fix that and nudge their metabolic rate back up into a nicer and more generous range, but if you've managed to really slow your metabolism down, you're aren't going to see great JUDDD losses if your calories are now too high for where your metabolism runs now after months/years of very low *low carb* calories.

3. Then too, so many of the people who come to JUDDD are women who still experience TOM, and we know that can wreck havoc with the readings on a scale. So even while the water weight is building, most expect a good loss when TOM is gone. If that's slow to leave, it's tremendously disappointing, and can lead to feeling JUDDD isn't working, when it may just be working slowly. LOL

4. And lastly, perhaps it's easy for us to expect faster weight loss on JUDDD than it is reasonable for us to count on. We need to remember, it's only half of the days of the month for the weight loss part, and the other days, we're eating well. Often very, very well. And yet, we expect the fast weight loss from JUDDD... that we haven't been getting from our previous plan... even though we're only holding calories low on half the days.

Truly, that may be expecting a bit too much. Especially if we're one of those who don't just shed weight quickly and easily in the first place.

Mostly I just think it takes more than a couple of weeks for many of us to adjust and adapt and stabilize on JUDDD before we then enter into reliable weight loss.

I hope you will try JUDDD again with the understanding that if you add back in carbs you will increase your scale weight with the regained water, but that the result isn't body FAT at all, and that once you stabilize, you will see the scale going down again.

paulabob 12-05-2011 07:02 PM

You probably know I did hcg to bust my 4 year long atkins stall. Not necessarily recommending it...just saying sometimes our systems need a shock of some sort. I understand how frustrating doing the same things others are doing without results...like banging head against wall, repeatedly.

Right now, I was pretty stalled on JUDDD the last month of November, so I've gone ahead and moved into maintenance mode aka Leptin Reset (Jack Kruse) style. Big breakfast, lots of protein, paleo. It's a relief to NOT be trying to lose weight...and probably something you should seriously consider for awhile to get your metabolism raised.

For my Down Days I generally ate twice a day a serving of lean protein and serving of veggie. Plus 100 calories or so reserved for a "snack" like coconut oil/cocoa powder or low cal cheese or yogurt.

Whatever you do, I wish you TONS of luck and awesome losing!

stardustshadow 12-06-2011 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulabob (Post 15227750)
You probably know I did hcg to bust my 4 year long atkins stall. Not necessarily recommending it...just saying sometimes our systems need a shock of some sort. I understand how frustrating doing the same things others are doing without results...like banging head against wall, repeatedly.

Right now, I was pretty stalled on JUDDD the last month of November, so I've gone ahead and moved into maintenance mode aka Leptin Reset (Jack Kruse) style. Big breakfast, lots of protein, paleo. It's a relief to NOT be trying to lose weight...and probably something you should seriously consider for awhile to get your metabolism raised.

For my Down Days I generally ate twice a day a serving of lean protein and serving of veggie. Plus 100 calories or so reserved for a "snack" like coconut oil/cocoa powder or low cal cheese or yogurt.

Whatever you do, I wish you TONS of luck and awesome losing!

I remember your doing Hcg! I have considered it, but where I live I believe it is next to impossible to get the tablets/drops. It is also extremely restrictive and I'd have to have a stress free month to try it in..(aka SUMMER BREAK!!). But anyhow, I keep hearing about Leptin reset. I am unclear on the science behind it, but my ears are always open!

Thank you for the encouragement...I wish you lots of luck too!! I hope your reset helps you and you lose those last pounds too:)

stardustshadow 12-06-2011 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoHappy (Post 15227635)
Here are two things I think happen to some folks within the first few weeks when people start JUDDD, both of which can result in disappointing scale readings. And the trouble when that happens is that folks are very liable to bale and run before giving their body the time it takes to settle into this plan and get into weight loss.

1. I think the vast majority of those who come to JUDDD from a previous low carb plan increase the number of carbs in their diet.

And sometimes they have previously been eating very low carb for many, many months and even years, so you can imagine how reactive their body will have become to carbs during that prior time of deprivation from carbohydrate.

I think this is what causes their *stall*, and in many cases, I'm pretty sure they are actually losing body FAT, even though the scale is not showing it, because I think that at the same time they are regaining some water weight in their liver and muscle tissue from adding come additional carbs back in.

I believe if they waited it out, remaining true to JUDDD for awhile longer, they would witness their body normalize it's fluid weight in relation to the carbs they are now going to be including in their diet, and at that point they would be able to watch their scale weight register lower and lower as the weeks went by.

2. I think there are some folks who have been on very low carb for so long, with such little appetite every day from following that diet choice, that they have brought themselves to the point of eating very, very, very few calories almost every day. They are all low carb calories, just very few of them daily.

We do know that in the face of an ongoing long-term very low calorie diet, the body really slows down its metabolic rate. I'm not saying they have irrevocably ruined their metabolisms.. only that they may be at a place finally where their metabolism is running much slower than those online calorie calculators would predict as their *calorie number*, so it's possible that by the time they take that UD number they are given and add some DD calories to it, that could possibly be quite a few MORE calories every two days than they were previously eating on low carb. Some people really don't eat much food on their very low carb plans, and have little appetite to eat more than they do anyway.

So for those people, they may have to hold their UDs to a few hundred calories less than the generic average they were given when they first did their figures. Not that they will have to remain at that... as I think JUDDD can fix that and nudge their metabolic rate back up into a nicer and more generous range, but if you've managed to really slow your metabolism down, you're aren't going to see great JUDDD losses if your calories are now too high for where your metabolism runs now after months/years of very low *low carb* calories.

3. Then too, so many of the people who come to JUDDD are women who still experience TOM, and we know that can wreck havoc with the readings on a scale. So even while the water weight is building, most expect a good loss when TOM is gone. If that's slow to leave, it's tremendously disappointing, and can lead to feeling JUDDD isn't working, when it may just be working slowly. LOL

4. And lastly, perhaps it's easy for us to expect faster weight loss on JUDDD than it is reasonable for us to count on. We need to remember, it's only half of the days of the month for the weight loss part, and the other days, we're eating well. Often very, very well. And yet, we expect the fast weight loss from JUDDD... that we haven't been getting from our previous plan... even though we're only holding calories low on half the days.

Truly, that may be expecting a bit too much. Especially if we're one of those who don't just shed weight quickly and easily in the first place.

Mostly I just think it takes more than a couple of weeks for many of us to adjust and adapt and stabilize on JUDDD before we then enter into reliable weight loss.

I hope you will try JUDDD again with the understanding that if you add back in carbs you will increase your scale weight with the regained water, but that the result isn't body FAT at all, and that once you stabilize, you will see the scale going down again.

Well, here is the strangeness...I did not gain weight when I first started JUDDD. I lost a ton of weight really fast (though I realize some of that was probably water...!). Despite adding carbs, the scale went down. I was thrilled, impressed etc. But then I hit TOM and it ALL came back, plus a little more. When TOM was over, the scale did not go down. I started to despair when even the strictest down day was not helping. Maybe I gave up too fast, I don't know...as I have said before, I was also feeling VERY uncomfortable with the amount of carbs I was eating (diabetic) and worried that I was letting JUDDD be an excuse to indulge in the carbs I had worked so hard to give up!

I am not sure what the heck was going on with my body at the time. But nothing I have tried since has solved my problem, either. I keep reading about how to break a stall, and the biggest suggestions are...intermittent fasting and calorie cycling...this is JUDDD!!

For some reason I feel BEtteR about severely restricting calories every other day then lowering cals a little every day. I don't know why, but it feels easier and more manageable to me.

sophiethecat 12-06-2011 10:43 AM

Hi SDS! :hiya: Good to see you here - I've missed you on the JUDDD forum.

I think you would do well with JUDDD and low(er) carb. Give it a try, maybe a month, min. to see if it breaks your stall and to see how you feel.

I'm doing my own mash-up of JUDDD by following Pirate Jenny's MUDDD (24 hr. schedule) most days, although I sometimes have 2 FD in a row if I'm out of town.

I am just coming off a 2 FD in a row, and am fasting until 5 or 6 tonight, where I will go back to FD eating until 5 - 7 p.m. tomorrow.

Breaking up my days around 5 - 7 p.m. seems to work great for me. I really don't have time to get hungry on the DD portion of it, and I can almost completely fast during that time, or else have one good meal with the full allotment of calories to get my through until the UD eating starts. You can check out that thread if you're interested.

I think the fasting or near-fasting DD part of JUDDD helps the pancreas preserve beta cells since it doesn't have to use them much during that time. And then in the UD eating part, I try not to graze all the time, but have "square" meals to also help BS.

So far everything is going well. Hope you find success in breaking your stall. Keep us updated :)

betty301 12-07-2011 05:33 AM

How long did you stick with JUDDD after TOM was over?

I stick with it even though I'm not getting GRAND results. But I'm a good example of JUDDD not working like we think it should.
My losses are not consistent and yes, it is very frustrating.

But I believe in the method. What other options do we have?

Eat very low cals everyday and do copious amounts of cardio?? No thanks!

:)

Give yourself two solid weeks of very good JUDDD'ing and go from there.

I don't count carbs on DDs, only calories. And I eat mostly veggies. I like to make big pots of soup!

hopetolose 12-07-2011 07:18 AM

Restarting again today. Was discouraged with it when I was doing this before because I kept going up and down the same 2 - 3#, but maybe will be different this time.


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