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Old 10-28-2011, 04:13 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoHappy View Post
Do you think there is any reason to refrain from just eating Monday's calories and Tuesday's calories whenever? If Monday is 2 DD meals plus 1 UD meal of 934 calories total, do you think it makes any difference in those hours when you eat? Over the course of our waking day, does it matter when we eat our calories?
What you're explaining is, I'm sure, some form of calorie cycling.
Whether it's more effective than JUDDD, or IF,
I doubt any of us could answer without a few months and some test subjects.

If achieving a near-fasting state is what makes JUDDD and IF more beneficial than just "dieting", I don't think what you're proposing is enough of a calorie difference to put the body in that state.

It might be enough, though, to cause more weight loss than eating restricted calories every day. And it might be a good plan when a person needs a few days off from JUDDD, so they have some guidance (everybody has questions about medium days!) and don't get too far out of the habit of the DDs.

I'm finding that sticking to a very low number of calories for a 24-hour window but then having more freedom the next 24 hours is much more interesting and fun and effective and nutritious than any other WOE I've ever tried!
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:19 PM   #62
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So Happy, I was going to say that I think for *some* of us who have a certain natural rhythm that results in hunger especially in the p.m.. that the method could be even more effective for us for the DD part of it and might result in less calories eaten on DD (and better result from the calorie restriction) as well as an easier time during the DD part of it.

For example, I normally can go without breakfast, so I might be able to get by with about 200 calories on a DD lunch before I'm ready to start UD dinner/breakfast/lunch just hours later... and then that next night would be DD dinner but I might only need another 200 calorie meal to help me get to sleep. Repeat the DD pattern in the a.m. (skipping b'fast) and a small meal later and then it's UD time again.

So in effect, might be able to do under 500 calories or less much easier than trying to last the whole regular DD and trying to get to sleep (my big challenge with whole regular DD is I can't sleep if I'm at all hungry those nights).

I hope I explained it well.
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Last edited by sophiethecat; 10-28-2011 at 04:37 PM..
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:35 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piratejenny View Post
What you're explaining is, I'm sure, some form of calorie cycling.
Whether it's more effective than JUDDD, or IF,
I doubt any of us could answer without a few months and some test subjects.

If achieving a near-fasting state is what makes JUDDD and IF more beneficial than just "dieting", I don't think what you're proposing is enough of a calorie difference to put the body in that state.

It might be enough, though, to cause more weight loss than eating restricted calories every day. And it might be a good plan when a person needs a few days off from JUDDD, so they have some guidance (everybody has questions about medium days!) and don't get too far out of the habit of the DDs.

I'm finding that sticking to a very low number of calories for a 24-hour window but then having more freedom the next 24 hours is much more interesting and fun and effective and nutritious than any other WOE I've ever tried!
I was just adding up calories for splitting the days at 3:00 pm with some of the UD cals being distributed over two different days, and being combined on those days with some DD calories, bringing the calorie totals from breakfast through dinner on the two days to 934 on one day alternating with 1367 on the other. As in your plan. So alternating between those two calorie results each breakfast-lunch-supper of alternating days.

I'm just taking this a step further than and wondering about breaking each new *day* down into three meals each in even calorie amounts, or do you think it would still work best to have DD breakfast, DD lunch, and then UD supper, rather than add those calories up and divide by three. Or from what you've read, would it make any difference when you ate the calories that day? I guess that's what I'm wondering. LOL Do you think it's important to respect the difference in the *days* and keep the DD breakfast and the DD lunch separated from the new calories of the UD supper, so to speak?

This is more difficult to discuss on a keyboard than I'd have guessed it would be.
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Last edited by SoHappy; 10-28-2011 at 04:37 PM..
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:49 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by lindaokc View Post
I am also jumping on this bandwagon, since I obviously can't keep my DD calories, or even my UP day calories within reason. Maybe this will make it easier.
Yeah, let's give it a shot and see what happens!
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:51 PM   #65
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Quote:
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....from what you've read, would it make any difference when you ate the calories that day?

Do you think it's important to respect the difference in the *days* and keep the DD breakfast and the DD lunch separated from the new calories of the UD supper, so to speak?
Yes and yes. I'm trying to achieve a state of near-fasting for 24 hours, as one does with regularly-scheduled JUDDD.

---------------------------------------------------------
I'm assuming Pat's addressing me, since she quoted me...
but if anyone else knows more about the effects of timing calorie consumption throughout the day, please chime in.
I feel like this plan is just a tweak to JUDDD, and the benefits/effects should be similar if not identical.
If you start mixing up your calories throughout the day/week,
somewhat based on the JUDDD calorie calculators but not on the schedule,
I have no idea what will happen!
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:51 PM   #66
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PirateJenny, I wanted to make sure you saw this:

I have a couple questions about Fri night, according to that sample schedule posted above.

I assume that the UD eating on Friday nights is not the full-allotted UD calories eaten all in one evening?

How many of the UD calories are you allowing on Fri evenings?

Thanks
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:52 PM   #67
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Yeah, let's give it a shot and see what happens!
If somebody's DD calories were going to be 500, and there UD calories were going to be 1800, how would their daily meals break down?
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Old 10-28-2011, 04:56 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoHappy View Post
If somebody's DD calories were going to be 500, and there UD calories were going to be 1800, how would their daily meals break down?
Let's say today was a DD b'fast & lunch... say they waited til 12 noon and ate about 200 calories. Later started the UD eating... they had maybe 1,000 calories between about 3 p.m. and bed.

Next day, they didn't eat breakfast, or ate a small one, and then had a decent size lunch and maybe some more to eat about 3 p.m. Along with the 1,000 calories last night, they made 1,800 total today.

Now, they might wait til about 7 p.m. and have a DD meal if they are hungry. And some more before bed, maybe 200 calories altogether before bed.

The pattern repeats.
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:01 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophiethecat View Post
I have a couple questions about Fri night, according to that sample schedule posted above.

I assume that the UD eating on Friday nights is not the full-allotted UD calories eaten all in one evening?

How many of the UD calories are you allowing on Fri evenings?

Thanks
Sorry, Sophie; I saw this earlier but I didn't realize you were addressing me.

I would say 1/3 of your UD calories, or whatever you usually allot for dinner on an UD.

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Old 10-28-2011, 05:02 PM   #70
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Sorry, Sophie; I saw this earlier but I didn't realize you were addressing me.

I would say 1/3 of your UD calories, or whatever you usually allot for dinner on an UD.
Thank you!! Cool, that would make for a nice evening
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:04 PM   #71
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This is more difficult to discuss on a keyboard than I'd have guessed it would be.
I know, I want one of those football play diagrams to indicate all the things I'm terrible at explaining!
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:07 PM   #72
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I'm going to go ahead and do the regular MUDDD schedule through the weekend because I screwed it up yesterday and then I spent too much time this evening trying to get it straight in my mind what I'd done wrong on ******, lol.

I should have had a DD yesterday p.m. but I didn't and went ahead with a full UD... then I got off track about two left-hand turns several streets back and went the wrong way down a one-way street, but I finally got here in one piece

Leave it to me to make things harder and more complicated than they ever need to be

Anyway, I'm doing UD tonight and tomorrow, ending with DD in the evening....
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:34 PM   #73
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ok. I really want to understand this from a calorie perspective.

Let's say I stop my UD eating at 3pm. Counting last night's dinner, breakfast, lunch and snack, my total calories from 7pm last night to 3pm today would be around 1800 calories. Starting with tonights dinner (200 cals) maybe a prebed snack (50-100) and tomorrow am/pm up to 3pm (200cals or so). At 3 would I then fast til dinner? no. I am going from 3pm to 3pm--right? So I could then have my UD--1800 cals any time between 3pm to the next day at 3pm. No need for a gap, right? I think I am making it more difficult than it is.
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:38 PM   #74
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ok. I really want to understand this from a calorie perspective.

Let's say I stop my UD eating at 3pm. Counting last night's dinner, breakfast, lunch and snack, my total calories from 7pm last night to 3pm today would be around 1800 calories. Starting with tonights dinner (200 cals) maybe a prebed snack (50-100) and tomorrow am/pm up to 3pm (200cals or so). At 3 would I then fast til dinner? no. I am going from 3pm to 3pm--right? So I could then have my UD--1800 cals any time between 3pm to the next day at 3pm. No need for a gap, right? I think I am making it more difficult than it is.
Trust me, Ouizoid, NOBODY is better at making things more difficult than me

From what I remember Pirate Jenny saying, if you are doing a b'fast and lunch DD, then you don't have to wait until 7 p.m. but can go ahead and start eating UD calories at 3 p.m.
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:42 PM   #75
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Here's what she said when I asked a similar thing:

1) When I'm transitioning from DDs (breakfast & lunch) to UDs (at 7pm), I don't worry too much if the DD calories "blur" into my UD because they will be rather scanty all day anyway; I would have used a portion of them the night before. Nor would I worry if I started at 5 or 6pm due to hunger or some change in plans.

2) When I'm transitioning from UDs (B & L) to DDs (at 7pm), I eat my last UD calories at 3pm to allow time for digestion and to start my DD on an empty stomach. If I ate from 7pm to 7pm, I would probably overeat calories and my DD would realistically be less than 24 hours.

3) If an UD ran late (7 or 8 pm when I meant to stop at 3), due to a social event or emergency, I would try to avoid eating anything the rest of the night, or keep it to 50-100 calories if I really needed a snack before bed. Then I would start my UD the next day at 7pm as planned.
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Old 10-28-2011, 06:15 PM   #76
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thanks Sophie! I am interested in the experiment!
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Old 10-28-2011, 07:26 PM   #77
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What I said about 3pm and 7pm was just an example--
and I thought it might work for people who get hungry at night or go out on weekends;
but a person could pick ANY time at all that works for them! 9pm, 1am, 11:23 am...
and of course have your UD dinner fall on different days,
or not repeat the schedule Fri & Sat...I kinda worked that out for a specific person with a specific schedule.

Anyway, I'm glad if some people find this helps them.
I do wish I could just draw a picture...I think it would be easier to understand!
I used to work a night shift & my schedule was "off" most people's by about 6 hours,
so maybe that's why I think the way I do!
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:16 AM   #78
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I'm going to stick to 3 p.m. as my "changeover" time for a while and see how it goes.

But let me get this part straight, Pirate Jenny - I'm still a little less sure about it... coming from a b'fast/lunch UD and switching to a DD dinner, I would need to eat my last UD food by 3 p.m. and then try to go for 4 hours to start DD eating, is that right? And the reason I don't just start into DD calories at 3 p.m. is to start DD on an empty stomach. So it will work better that way?

Just trying to make sure I understand that part. Because I remember that on a DD b'fast/lunch day, if I want to switch right at 3 p.m. to UD eating I can.
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:20 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophiethecat View Post
Let's say today was a DD b'fast & lunch... say they waited til 12 noon and ate about 200 calories. Later started the UD eating... they had maybe 1,000 calories between about 3 p.m. and bed.

Next day, they didn't eat breakfast, or ate a small one, and then had a decent size lunch and maybe some more to eat about 3 p.m. Along with the 1,000 calories last night, they made 1,800 total today.

Now, they might wait til about 7 p.m. and have a DD meal if they are hungry. And some more before bed, maybe 200 calories altogether before bed.

The pattern repeats.
This is almost how things have gone for me so far on my first real cycle of MUDDD I am a 600 DD/1700-1800 UD person, and my day went almost as I described to you yesterday.

Yesterday, a DD bfast/lunch, I skipped bfast and ate about noon, under 200 calories. Then later started my UD at 3. I ate almost 1,200 calories over the evening.

And today, still on UD eating, I've skipped bfast and will need to get in all my UD calories by 3 p.m. when I start DD.


Last edited by sophiethecat; 10-29-2011 at 09:43 AM..
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:25 AM   #80
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Hey Jenny and anyone reading this thread, I started my first real cycle of MUDDD yesterday and lost a pound this a.m. I think I was ripe for losing it all week long, but still, it managed to happen after all that UD eating I did last night before bed.

So, I'm going to continue on this schedule for a while and see how I do. I still have about 600 calories to get in by 3 p.m. and no hunger at all yet, as is usual for me (it's 11:30 a.m.)

I'll let ya know how things go later this evening when I'm into DD eating. The great thing is I'll have so many calories to eat what I need to help me sleep tonight. Going to bed on DD nights was always the worst thing about DD for me. Now I have plenty of calories to make sure I go to bed full Because I won't need to eat a DD bfast tomorrow most likely, and that leaves calories for noon - 3 and then I can just do UD eating again!
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:44 AM   #81
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I'm going to stick to 3 p.m. as my "changeover" time for a while and see how it goes.

But let me get this part straight, Pirate Jenny - I'm still a little less sure about it... coming from a b'fast/lunch UD and switching to a DD dinner, I would need to eat my last UD food by 3 p.m. and then try to go for 4 hours to start DD eating, is that right? And the reason I don't just start into DD calories at 3 p.m. is to start DD on an empty stomach. So it will work better that way?

Just trying to make sure I understand that part. Because I remember that on a DD b'fast/lunch day, if I want to switch right at 3 p.m. to UD eating I can.
If your changeover time is 3pm,
then I would use my last UD calories by 11am and start DD calories at 3pm.

That's if you want to have that 4-hr gap.
I'm making this up as I go; if something else works better for you, do that!
It really all depends on when you are hungry.

Quote:
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I started my first real cycle of MUDDD yesterday and lost a pound this a.m. I think I was ripe for losing it all week long, but still, it managed to happen after all that UD eating I did last night before bed.
Way to go!!!
I experienced the same thing--a slight loss after a DD + UD dinner.
Also, the weight fluctuations I was seeing at first 2-4lb difference between UDs & DDs are much less crazy now.
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:46 AM   #82
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Thank you!


So that four hour gap is to make sure to start DD eating on an empty stomach.
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:56 AM   #83
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Thank you!


So that four hour gap is to make sure to start DD eating on an empty stomach.
Right--because if you were doing DD on the regular schedule, you would wake up on an empty stomach.

And if your were to eat from 3pm on 3pm on your UD, you would need time to digest that last meal; then your DD would really be more like 20 or 18 hours. Which might not be a bad thing. I just think it gets further away from the JUDDD/Intermittent Fasting concept.

Good luck, Sophie!!!
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Old 10-29-2011, 10:00 AM   #84
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Thanks so much, PJenny! I understand it all now.

I'm enjoying it. I'll keep everyone updated

Tonight is going to be so awesome to not have to worry about stretching DD calories all day in hopes of getting enough food before bed. Whoo hoo!
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Old 10-29-2011, 01:52 PM   #85
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I'm finding that sticking to a very low number of calories for a 24-hour window but then having more freedom the next 24 hours is much more interesting and fun and effective and nutritious than any other WOE I've ever tried!
Love this too! Definitely worked better for my bod than regular JUDDD (who knows why) and this week, I've lost 4 lbs
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Old 10-29-2011, 02:09 PM   #86
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Thanks so much, PJenny! I understand it all now.

I'm enjoying it. I'll keep everyone updated

Tonight is going to be so awesome to not have to worry about stretching DD calories all day in hopes of getting enough food before bed. Whoo hoo!
sophiecat

This looks like another way I could avoid binging as it looks like you never really have the opportunity to get overly hungry. Correct me if that assumption is wrong! Would you mind laying out what a sample of the up/dd progression would like as a rough estimate?
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Old 10-29-2011, 04:00 PM   #87
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Love this too! Definitely worked better for my bod than regular JUDDD (who knows why) and this week, I've lost 4 lbs
Wow Jouette!! Where's the Like button!!
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Old 10-29-2011, 04:58 PM   #88
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Love this too! Definitely worked better for my bod than regular JUDDD (who knows why) and this week, I've lost 4 lbs
Cool, Jouette, I didn't know you were still JUDDDg! Great results - 4 lb. - whooo hoooo!!!
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Old 10-29-2011, 05:30 PM   #89
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Sophie and/or Pirate Jenny Question

Sophie - I like the way you laid out the scheduling and I'm thinking it might work out better for me. Also thank you graciously to Pirate Jenny for even thinking this plan up and sharing. Since you and I are not breakfast eaters, how are you handing Breakfast times on this system? Are you eating your breakfast/lunch combo around 10-11 am?

I ask because 1) I'm new and 2) this is my 2nd down day and I've held off eating anything until 6:00 p.m. tonight. Yeah, saving my calories for evening because of that being my hungry time. I would have like to have something for lunch but knew I would have to have something b-4 bed.

It worked out ok today but I was at home but when I go back to work, it's going to be harder to hold off eating till later in the day on my DD's . So, I'm thinking after I undertstand this and see how it may play out in real life, I might implement this.

My calories are UD: 2000/DD: 500.
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Old 10-29-2011, 05:41 PM   #90
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Did you end up using the rotation in post #32?
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