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Old 04-14-2010, 09:53 AM   #91
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Ing-
Welcome back! The only way I know to deal with my appetite is low carb. It certainly doesn't kill my appetite (as a lot of folks report), but it makes it bearable. And low carb is certainly perfect for diabetics. So if I were you, I'd try to eat as low carb as possible until you think you can manage a DD.

Some people also have found it good to 'back into' the DD pattern. That is, they don't think they can go straight to <500 cal, so they begin with something like 800 or 900, and then just gradually go lower. You might want to try to work it that way.

Kisha-
I feel for you. And I know that I personally could not wait until I was "optimized" (which can take months) to begin losing. Keep in mind that I began losing when I was undiagnosed hypo, so it IS possible, even if very, very slow.

Here's advice from my own experience (ignore anything that doesn't seem right for you). Since you're a fan of ****** (or whatever the online management system is called), you know the number of calories that you're eating right now. If you're not gaining, but not losing either, that's your maintenance level, and you need to shed 500 cals daily from that number.

Try that for a week, and see if it's any help. But my advice would be to NOT count your calories at the end of the day. If you know your target, plan in advance (as we do for DDs), so you know exactly what you're going to eat. For me, unless I do this on my UDs, I always eat too much, no matter how 'careful' I try to be.

And watch the carbs. There's no way I can manage my eating if I eat the 'bad' carbs. I strongly suspect that my own CCL is about 30g. Above that, and the scale seems to go up no matter what I do.
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Old 04-14-2010, 11:08 AM   #92
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Ing-
Welcome back! The only way I know to deal with my appetite is low carb. It certainly doesn't kill my appetite (as a lot of folks report), but it makes it bearable. And low carb is certainly perfect for diabetics. So if I were you, I'd try to eat as low carb as possible until you think you can manage a DD.

Some people also have found it good to 'back into' the DD pattern. That is, they don't think they can go straight to <500 cal, so they begin with something like 800 or 900, and then just gradually go lower. You might want to try to work it that way.

Kisha-
I feel for you. And I know that I personally could not wait until I was "optimized" (which can take months) to begin losing. Keep in mind that I began losing when I was undiagnosed hypo, so it IS possible, even if very, very slow.

Here's advice from my own experience (ignore anything that doesn't seem right for you). Since you're a fan of ****** (or whatever the online management system is called), you know the number of calories that you're eating right now. If you're not gaining, but not losing either, that's your maintenance level, and you need to shed 500 cals daily from that number.

Try that for a week, and see if it's any help. But my advice would be to NOT count your calories at the end of the day. If you know your target, plan in advance (as we do for DDs), so you know exactly what you're going to eat. For me, unless I do this on my UDs, I always eat too much, no matter how 'careful' I try to be.

And watch the carbs. There's no way I can manage my eating if I eat the 'bad' carbs. I strongly suspect that my own CCL is about 30g. Above that, and the scale seems to go up no matter what I do.
Thanks Leo, Gina... everyone. I HAVE been eating HIGH calories this whole week despite my avowall that I wouldn't... I think If I really really really stick with 1600 per day and the 35g of carbs (I have to work to get this many in) for an entire week I'll have a better picture of whats going on. Honestly I havent GAINED doing this much higher daily calories much higher daily carbs and that is actually a GREAT THING. All this extra T3 and what is surely higher cals and carbs ona daily basis and I weigh the same today as I did one week ago.

I'm just FREAKED OUT at the actual number. The fact is though this is the weight that I went into the dr. with last wednesday. I'll have to work to get it off.

WHY IS NOTHING EASY IN THIS WORLD!?!?! LOL...
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Old 04-14-2010, 11:51 AM   #93
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I told my sister last night that if there really IS reincarnation, in my next life I'm owed a thin body
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Old 04-14-2010, 12:00 PM   #94
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I told my sister last night that if there really IS reincarnation, in my next life I'm owed a thin body
I KNOW RIGHT!?!?! LOL.
My mom the other day when we were talking about all my thyroid crap said she feels so bad cuz she feels like she gave us crappy genes... (she's thin but barely eats)

I told her no way mom... you gave us beautiful faces! And I'd rather be beautiful and fat(ish) than a butterface. LOL.
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Old 04-14-2010, 05:48 PM   #95
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Old 04-14-2010, 05:50 PM   #96
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:22 PM   #97
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GEORGOUS!!!! (GO GIANTS!)
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:48 PM   #98
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Hey, folks, what's my plan going to be?

Well, I DID lose pre-diagnosis on LC, 24 pounds before stalling out. Starting from 10 pounds lighter than I am now, dang it... But I didn't have a lot of energy. And even if I wasn't hungry, I was fitdaying and calculating and planning and coming up with new things to make with HWC or cheese and was food-obsessed. And then, of course, I stalled.

And then the rest of the health stuff started.

Later on, in the throws of trying to get supplemented, I did JUDD for about 3 weeks. Problem was, I didn't eat enough on my UDs. They became all DDs, because without enough thyroid I just didn't eat. (TOTAL opposite from current situation!) I saw an endo in May of last year because the doc that took out my thyroid took out at least two parathyroids so I had a calcium issue. And I sat there while he told me what I needed was a chair with wheels on it (I kid you not), so that I could push away from the table. At that moment, at the appointment, I had not eaten in two days. I didn't eat at all the day before and didn't eat that day because it was an afternoon appt and I thought there might be blood drawn. So I was pretty irritated by his position.

Anyway, I lost a few pounds in 3 weeks on JUDD and then decided it was crazy to not eat. And then I got more meds and started eating

And in the last year, I have tried to LC a few times and basically make it about a week. I have not inducted for real, but watch the water weight come off as my glycogen stores deplete, and then nothing else happens and I lose patience. And then I stop worrying about LCing and another few extra pounds come back beyond the glycogen/water.

So then I was wondering if it is the cortef and maybe cortisone shot thing that was working a trick on me? Or maybe I am just too wimpy about the LC bit and need to be more perserverent and less of a ninny.

I guess I want to JUDD, I just don't want to be hungry! And it is dangerous to have to do too much counting and fiddling because then I think about nothing but food.

What a sob story this is, huh? I just need a big kick in the a$$?



Oui, BEAUTIFUL!
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Eat Well and Be Strong!

03/08-06/08: 248 - 224
Then life intervened

Cancer gone, diabetes under control, thyroid replacement on board...back at the drawing board! Here I go again!

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Old 04-14-2010, 10:10 PM   #99
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I know you're right... the rest of my labs won't even be in for TWO ENTIRE WEEKS. And then my follow up appointment had to get pushed from 5/5 to 6/15 because of WORK ()

Do you think he'll give me additional direction/prescription before then after my labs are in? I'd like to know what i'm supposed to be doing about the severe iodine defficiency and do NOT want to do anything unless its on his specific instruction.

YES theres something else going on for sure. I think my whole system has just gotten so wacked out.

ALSO I haven't gotten the RT3 number yet but if I have high RT3 it will take six weeks or so for the T4 that I was intaking to get out of my system. Its that T4 thats converting to the RT3 so I would think it would take at least that long (the six weeks) to start really feeling better. I DO FEEL BETTER somewhat but nowhere near 100% and still get sleepy VERY SLEEPY lik CANNOT STAY AWAKE sleepy during the day Monday and yesterday.
He didn't recommend anything for me before the labs came in except vit D. Have you been tested for antibodies? I read that iodine will make Hashis worse.

Call them everyday and see if they have a cancellation. I got squeezed in that way. You can also get a copy of your labs when they come in. At least you'll have a clue about what's going on even if you can't get to see him any earlier.

Oh, and I recently learned what a "Butterface" is. You certainly aren't that.
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Old 04-14-2010, 10:34 PM   #100
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Hey, folks, what's my plan going to be?

Well, I DID lose pre-diagnosis on LC, 24 pounds before stalling out. Starting from 10 pounds lighter than I am now, dang it... But I didn't have a lot of energy. And even if I wasn't hungry, I was fitdaying and calculating and planning and coming up with new things to make with HWC or cheese and was food-obsessed. And then, of course, I stalled.

And then the rest of the health stuff started.

Later on, in the throws of trying to get supplemented, I did JUDD for about 3 weeks. Problem was, I didn't eat enough on my UDs. They became all DDs, because without enough thyroid I just didn't eat. (TOTAL opposite from current situation!) I saw an endo in May of last year because the doc that took out my thyroid took out at least two parathyroids so I had a calcium issue. And I sat there while he told me what I needed was a chair with wheels on it (I kid you not), so that I could push away from the table. At that moment, at the appointment, I had not eaten in two days. I didn't eat at all the day before and didn't eat that day because it was an afternoon appt and I thought there might be blood drawn. So I was pretty irritated by his position.

Anyway, I lost a few pounds in 3 weeks on JUDD and then decided it was crazy to not eat. And then I got more meds and started eating

And in the last year, I have tried to LC a few times and basically make it about a week. I have not inducted for real, but watch the water weight come off as my glycogen stores deplete, and then nothing else happens and I lose patience. And then I stop worrying about LCing and another few extra pounds come back beyond the glycogen/water.

So then I was wondering if it is the cortef and maybe cortisone shot thing that was working a trick on me? Or maybe I am just too wimpy about the LC bit and need to be more perserverent and less of a ninny.

I guess I want to JUDD, I just don't want to be hungry! And it is dangerous to have to do too much counting and fiddling because then I think about nothing but food.

What a sob story this is, huh? I just need a big kick in the a$$?



Oui, BEAUTIFUL!
OH MY GOD!!! That makes me so unbelievably angry! It is just freaking HEINOUS what we put up with getting called crazy/lazy. I thought what i heard was bad but NOTHING can top that. OMG! lord that really frosts my cookies!

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He didn't recommend anything for me before the labs came in except vit D. Have you been tested for antibodies? I read that iodine will make Hashis worse.

Call them everyday and see if they have a cancellation. I got squeezed in that way. You can also get a copy of your labs when they come in. At least you'll have a clue about what's going on even if you can't get to see him any earlier.

Oh, and I recently learned what a "Butterface" is. You certainly aren't that.
Nope no antibodies so not hashis... I'll keep on for a cancellation thats how I got this last appointment. I managed to do good today on calories so I'm feeling slightly better

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Old 04-15-2010, 02:18 AM   #101
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First of all, I would never go back to a doctor who spoke to me that way! How demeaning!!

Second, I think it's too soon for you to be doing JUDDD. You're better off just trying to low carb for a while to see if you can lose that way. There's no way to do JUDDD and not be hungry--at least in my experience. I lost about 80 lbs before I 'stalled' on standard low carb. And I didn't "induct," just cut my carbs.

But your post suggests to me why you may have had trouble losing because you refer to making recipies and using HWC and cheese. I don't know whether it's just me, but I don't lose unless I eat very simply. I never make recipes--just poach or broil my meat or fish, fry my eggs, etc. I think that you can add a lot of calories and carbs without realizing it when you make things.
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Old 04-15-2010, 04:48 AM   #102
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Hey Ilpirata and Leo, I SO did not go back to that doc. Boy was I mad. He is the dean of medicine at a medical school....fabulous, huh? Meant nothing for the standard of care, and he isn't teaching new docs to be any better. I was in his office for 3 hours. I had a resident of his test me for peripheral neuropathy without asking me to remove my socks. And he did not address my calcium problem; said the numbness and weakness I was having wasn't bad enough to treat, and that I am too fat. And whatever I was eating (which was nothing, then) was too much. And he spent 10 minutes lecturing about how I need an ID bracelet, having neglected to notice that I was wearing the ID bracelet I have had on for 3 years before his visit. What a boob.

Anyway, Leo, I started out doing original Atkins, and after induction, HWC and cheese were legal. I always moderated carbs tightly but I understand some people stall on dairy even if the carbs are kept low. I think it is just human nature...my nature, anyway... to try for a mile if I can get an inch. It was too tempting to try to make the LC life more exciting. I like to cook.

Anyway, I think the idea is that I need a paradigm shift in the way I think about food. I have to think about food as a medication, not as a drug.

For several months I know I was eating as self-medication for my shoulder pain. I quit smoking 3 1/2 years ago cold turkey, and I was a pretty solid addict, chemically and behaviorally. If only you could quite eating cold turkey Trying to quit carbs cold turkey is not as simple, for me.

It might be too early to JUDD.

And then I am wondering if the immense carb cravings are part of the diabetic syndrome, because maybe my body isn't recognizing the amylin my piddly pancreas can still make (the same way it isn't recognizing the insulin). I might ask my PCP to give me one of the amylin-replacing drugs and see if that helps the appetite.

I am pretty good at making excuses, maybe, huh?

Anywho, off on a road trip for the next six days. I am doing the driving, which is far better for me than being a passenger. I know I cannot sit in the passenger seat without eating...a lot...and even if I pack a big bag of smart snacks I am lured in at all of the gas station stops. This trip I know I won't be able to LC because of places I am going, and as long as I am walking around a lot, at least the carbs won't make me need more insulin.

So you all have a nice weekend! I don't know if I will be on while I am away. Leo, you are still remarkable to me. Ilpirata, I am totally down with the scale being high and stuck; you are going to get this straightened out, Winston! NSS, glad to see your smiling face again, now that I am back on LCF! Oui, seriously, gorgeous--keep doing what you do! And GME...I see you are a runner? I started that at the beginning of the year, got sidelined with shinsplints and then bronchitis, and need to get back to it! I wanted to do a 5K in July and it isn't looking good...

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Old 04-15-2010, 06:30 AM   #103
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Ing, what a nightmare you have endured! I think my sad little thyroid story is bad, but yikes! I sure hope you get it figured out.

About running... this is my standard new runner advice, especially if I hear about aches and pains. Go to a running store and get fitted for shoes. They will either put you on a treadmill or take you outside and watch you run and then fit you for some shoes based on that. It can make a WORLD of difference. The Couch to 5K program is fabulous if you are just getting started. Oh, and Moving Comfort bras will keep everything where it belongs in the chestular area. That is a big deal for me.
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:25 AM   #104
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Hey--thanks for the nice compliments everybody--Kisha--yeah! Go Giants!

It is interesting to me--all our struggles and cravings--and the feeling of being helpless around our cravings--Leo--where is that Eades article about the nucleus accumbens and its influence on cravings? oh here it is

Low-carb battles in your brain | The Blog of Michael R. Eades, M.D.

interesting stuff--
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:33 AM   #105
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You must have posted your picture at the same time that I was posting last night because I didn't see it until this morning--seriously gorgeous! If I looked like that, I think I'd be maintaining right now!

Ing-
I KNOW that HWC and cheese are 'legal' foods on Atkins. My point was that it's possible to stall (I can even gain) on legal foods. Calories do count. I don't mean to be snarky, but the reason you're having carb cravings is that you're eating carbs. Cold turkey is necessary to banish cravings. And I also think it's possible to travel and stay low carb with just a little planning. I do it all the time. If the carby junk that's available on the road tempts you, then I don't really see low carb in your future. I might indulge in carbs now and then, but certainly none of that awful stuff.

Kisha-
Don't be too sure that you don't have Hashimoto's (not saying you do). Mine was diagnosed by the pathologist who biopsied my nodule. Later, my endo said that he would never have made the diagnosis from my blood work because the antibodies were too low. The way I understand it (and I could be wrong here), unless the antibodies are actively attacking the thyroid at the time the blood is drawn, you might not show enough to warrant a diagnosis of Hashimoto's but could still have the disease. The biopsy is conclusive, so there's no doubt with me, but there would be if I'd had to rely on the blood tests.
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Old 04-15-2010, 09:33 AM   #106
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Ouis-
You must have posted your picture at the same time that I was posting last night because I didn't see it until this morning--seriously gorgeous! If I looked like that, I think I'd be maintaining right now!

Ing-
I KNOW that HWC and cheese are 'legal' foods on Atkins. My point was that it's possible to stall (I can even gain) on legal foods. Calories do count. I don't mean to be snarky, but the reason you're having carb cravings is that you're eating carbs. Cold turkey is necessary to banish cravings. And I also think it's possible to travel and stay low carb with just a little planning. I do it all the time. If the carby junk that's available on the road tempts you, then I don't really see low carb in your future. I might indulge in carbs now and then, but certainly none of that awful stuff.

Kisha-
Don't be too sure that you don't have Hashimoto's (not saying you do). Mine was diagnosed by the pathologist who biopsied my nodule. Later, my endo said that he would never have made the diagnosis from my blood work because the antibodies were too low. The way I understand it (and I could be wrong here), unless the antibodies are actively attacking the thyroid at the time the blood is drawn, you might not show enough to warrant a diagnosis of Hashimoto's but could still have the disease. The biopsy is conclusive, so there's no doubt with me, but there would be if I'd had to rely on the blood tests.

o dear lord. My antibodies were SO LOW <20 and <10 both well well under the reference range. No I gotta assume I don't have hashi's...
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Old 04-15-2010, 12:00 PM   #107
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Kisha-
I'm sure you don't have Hashi's, but I just thought I'd mention my experience in case there was an ambiguity in your results. The treatment is the same, anyway.

Ouis-
I read that Eades article a while ago, and I'd forgotten it--thanks for the reminder. I remember at the time, I thought that LCF (and especially our JUDDD) group was for me the equivalent of AA for an alcoholic. When I was struggling with DDs early on, I would come here repeatedly throughout the day, and it really helped.

I also notice that Eades refers to "low carb diet" in that article, and thinking of it as a 'diet' is the easiest way to go off because you can always say, "Just this once" and "I'll get back on plan tomorrow," etc. etc.

I now eat 'my way' with an almost religiouis ferver, and I never think of it as a 'diet'--mainly because I know that I need to eat this way for the rest of my life. I've got that 'guardian' part of the brain really ramped up. Now if I can only keep it powerful. . . .
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Old 04-15-2010, 07:21 PM   #108
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Hey guys, WIFI ... yahoo!

Thanks for the smack, Leo. No problems avoiding crunchy chip temptation since I am driving When I am a passenger, if I am not careful I eat like I used to smoke, lighting one off the previous one. That is a behavioral battle, more than a carb craving issue. (And I think sometimes these are texture cravings, perhaps more so than carb cravings). Anywho, trouble with LC this trip is that I don't feel I can impose my WOE on people--aquaintances and friends, not family -- who are hosting me at their homes. I did that for several months when I started with this in '08 and there was never a way, it seemed, to pull it off and leave people feeling comfortable. My sister was ready to kill me; we went on a trip together visiting old family friends who were concerned about what diabetic I could eat, and my sister just about bowled me over with the stinkeye (she is in the health care field and still believes the carb-laden ADA diet must be appropriate). So, anyway, WOE militance is offputting, and though I can work it to that level once I get solidly back on plan, not this weekend. While I can try to walk the straight and narrow around people's menues, it frequently doesn't work, and I really can't politely just pass on everything but the butter Since I am not inducted already, I think it is realistic to say it ain't gonna happen in the next few days, when other people are hosting me.

That said, tonight is a hotel night and all I had all day was some chicken. KFC has some grilled options now...not bad at all! I am LC prodigal, not hopeless

A point of clarification: Leo, do you find veggie carbs work out OK for you? Personally they do not seem to cause stalls or cravings, but we are instructed that "carbs are carbs," (they certainly are as far as insulin requirements go) so the difference in response is interesting. FRUIT carbs, on the other hand, can set off a binge. But anyway, seems veggies (even not the heavy hitters like carrots) have more carbs than HWC or most cheese. I think there is something peculiar to dairy (other than fat calories) that is a staller, not just the carb part.

Kisha, I am happy you at least got tested for Hashi's! That is a step in the direction of good care. I never got tested, despite the whole cascade of suspicious symptoms, and was diagnosed when the surgeon pulled my useless, rubbery thyroid out. I am really happy you are not living in the dark ages on this one!

GME,thanks for the running tips. I started with the C25K and modified it because I found I was a total drama queen on every interval--whether I could run it or not, my brain kicked in and said "oh, no! Not another 30 seconds! You CAN'T!" It was ridiculous. It got better when I just told myself to go as long as I could, then rest some, then go again. And the shin splint and cramp stuff was probably mineral-related (that evil calcium issue again, and others). I dosed up on mineral supps and did stretching (sometimes interrupting a run 4 times to stretch, at the advice of my PT who I was "conveniently" seeing for the shoulder bit). Gotta get back in that saddle, though! After some good days walking around being a tourist this week I think I will be ready to hop back on.

Keep the faith, ladies!

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Old 04-16-2010, 05:17 AM   #109
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I totally agree that this isn't the time to go low carb. You want to give yourself a time when you know you can manage your own food for at least 2 weeks. You don't need to be dealing with other people when you're trying to deal with yourself.

HOWEVER, I'm not diabetic, but I'm trying to avoid it (runs in family), and if I actually were diagnosed, I would never let anyone dictate my food choices, whether or not I was a guest. I have a good friend (type 1) who has been dealing with this all his life. He's a priest who is frequently invited out to dinner, and he always phones his host or hostess in advance to tell them about his dietary needs. He finds that there's always something on the menu that he can eat, and since they've been told in advance, no one is upset if he refuses specific foods. This is with relative strangers; all his family and friends know that he doesn't eat carbs, fruit, etc. And we know how important it is for him to manage his diet.

I have no problem with veggies, but I am careful to limit them to a max of 10-12 carbs per meal. I never eat carrots--too carby (and I don't really care for them). As a diabetic, you should look at Dr. Richard Bernstein's website. Even if you don't follow his diet plan, the science behind it is really helpful. I first heard of limiting veggie carbs from Dr. Eades, but Dr. Bernstein advises the same numbers--so as not to invoke an insulin response.

I don't eat fruit because, as someone on another board posted, it's just "sugar from a tree." I've eliminated dairy, and when I did, I had a slight drop in BG. My endo said that it was probably from the lactose (sugar) in dairy, so even though it's a small amount, that's probably why it can cause problems for low carbers.

Interestingly, yesterday I had a lunch date, and while I had only a low carb salad, I was incredibly hungry when I got home. I suspect that the greens were treated with MSG or some other additive because I tend to be very sensitive to those things. That's why I avoid restaurants whenever I can, even though I love eating out.

Hope you can get back on track after this weekend--you owe it to yourself!
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Old 04-16-2010, 08:32 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by melehundele View Post
GME,thanks for the running tips. I started with the C25K and modified it because I found I was a total drama queen on every interval--whether I could run it or not, my brain kicked in and said "oh, no! Not another 30 seconds! You CAN'T!" It was ridiculous. It got better when I just told myself to go as long as I could, then rest some, then go again. And the shin splint and cramp stuff was probably mineral-related (that evil calcium issue again, and others). I dosed up on mineral supps and did stretching (sometimes interrupting a run 4 times to stretch, at the advice of my PT who I was "conveniently" seeing for the shoulder bit). Gotta get back in that saddle, though! After some good days walking around being a tourist this week I think I will be ready to hop back on.

Keep the faith, ladies!
I played a little mind trick with myself in the beginning. If I was running for 90 seconds and I thought I. just. wouldn't. make. it. I would think of all the other unpleasant things I have endured for 90 seconds- like a pap smear, scrubbing toilets, boring staff meetings- was being out in the fresh air, getting healthy, running in the sunshine really worse than that? No, of course not.


I took a peek at the scale this morning and am having good thoughts about tomorrow's weigh-in. This WOE is sooooo much easier to follow when there are results. I am really, firmly believeing that (for me anyway) the trick is in the UDs and not letting them get out of hand. I always drop down after a DD, but if it isn't as much or more than I went up after my last UD, what good is it doing?

Have a great JUDDD day everyone!
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Old 04-16-2010, 08:45 AM   #111
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YUP gme. UD's. No question. DDs work wonders, but only if UD's are firmly in hand. I have been doing eggs/butter/cheese on my UDs and I am seeing results--not only that, but my DD's have been much less painful and I am far less hungry. I won't do this forever, but for now, it is helping me get everything under control. I am going to have a carbup on Sunday (going to a dim sum party--going to be hard to find anything LC to eat, so carbup it is)--DD next day, and then back to meat and eggs.
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Old 04-16-2010, 09:52 AM   #112
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The only problem I see is that if UDs are too tightly controlled, then we'll get burned out on JUDDD. I want to be able to eat comfortably low carb on my UDs at about 1400 cal. That's the level that I think I can maintain if I just add a little to my DDs for maintenance.

I'm far from consistently keeping my UD cals at 1400, so that's my current goal. Why, oh, why do they add up so very quickly
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Old 04-16-2010, 10:18 AM   #113
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That is very true, Leo. I do pick one day a week (usually Saturday) where I have a true UP day. I have a big breakfast, go out for dinner, eat something if I am really having a craving for it. The rest of the RDs I eat what I think is good for me, but higher calorie- avocados, olive oil, butter, nuts, etc, but not to much of anything and not too late at night. I know it goes against the whole calories in-calories out idea, but volume & timing of food seems to make a big difference to me.
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Old 04-17-2010, 01:26 AM   #114
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Weekly Weigh In

Down only half a pound this morning (sigh!), and I immediately began to worry about my thyroid numbers. At my visit in early March, my T3 was only at half of the range (should be higher), but my endo won't add any more unless I'm really having symptoms. (Low calorie eating tends to suppress T3.)


I'm concerned because my weight has 'waffled' around 181-183 all of March and into April with no regular loss. HOWEVER, I also let me UDs get out of control for a while, and last weekend with company and cooking, etc., I had two high calorie days, so there's a good explanation for this apart from thyroid. I was hoping that those high calorie days would "stimulate" some weight loss, but obviously that doesn't work for me

In addition, I'm at truly VFT for me, and my body may just be 'adjusting.'

The good news is that the past 5 days have been OK---controlled UDs and good DDs. I think the key is to keep this up for a while before I jump to any conclusions about my thyroid.

I may do carbs tomorrow. I've been reading that it's important to keep fat low, and I'll stay within my calorie limits as well. No sugar or other bad stuff--just brown rice and beans and perhaps a couple of sweet potatoes or a bagel.
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Old 04-17-2010, 06:48 AM   #115
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For what it's worth-was doing really well with JUDDD and had lost 25#-then had a cortisone shot in my frozen shoulder, and shortly after that couldn't stay on plan for the next 3 months. Gained back 8#, lost that-then got back solidly on JUDDD for another 3 months and was happily losing a pound a week.
Got the pneumonia (Feb) and was given a short course of steroids again-same thing, my appetite is out of control and have regained about 8#-a conincidence, I don't think so. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?
I did get relief from the shoulder, my son is a massage therapist and he worked on the shoulder for a couple months, and it is 99% better, along with some essential oils.
Well, if this is anything like last summer-the effects should be wearing off, if that's what it is, and I should get back to effective JUDDD-the last couple months my DDs have all been close to 700-800 and the UDs way too high. But maybe it would have been worse without them. I think I'll take your advice Leo, and let the calories go down slowly til I get to 500 again. Maybe I lost my SIRT1, will have to consider that.
Good luck to all of us, I appreciate your struggles and what you are doing about it.
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Old 04-17-2010, 07:36 AM   #116
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Leo, NN, GME, Kisha, Mele--I know I am leaving some folks out--

I have noticed both on this board and the main lobby that people are struggling, stalled, gaining, appetites out of control. I have to think there might be a seasonal component--e.g., we are out of hibernation, depleted our winter fat stores, and need to put on fat pronto to gear up for the summer hunts etc. (sounds good anyhoo!!). I think leptin stores might be depleted (carbup leo!) and our appetites feel like they might be raging (or suppressed due to LC but still the body resists fat loss)--I think if we can hang on a bit longer, this might reverse. And of course==all our individual factors, set points, meds, environments etc don't help--

Moral of the story? Hang in there, try not to get too discouraged--I am having trouble right now having much interest in doing DDs--probably because I am doing M/E--and I can't really "diet multitask" lol. I will follow this path a bit longer, and if I don't start losing, I will go back to JUDDD--I just didn't like the bingy feelings I got on my UDs.

sigh

Ouis
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Old 04-17-2010, 07:55 AM   #117
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Hey Ladies!

Checking in. Staying sensible but not on LC plan. It's OK, though, keeping moving.

Nitenurse, thanks for the info about your steroid history. They lead you to think that single events like a cort shot won't affect your weight, but it seems maybe that is not the case for people with fragile metabolisms.

Hey Ouiz, you may have a point. We are still primal in many ways, and maybe spring is a culprit.

GME, funny to hear other people have to "fool themselves" too. Sometimes I wonder why I have to be so darned argumentative Great to know I am not unique in that!

Leo, gosh, you have come so far...you are nearly half the woman you once were (at least, 2/3!)from reading your points. If your body needs to catch up and understand that where you are is just a resting point, cut it slack. Half a pound is half a pound

What you guys go through with the thyroid issues is saddening. Having been untreated Hashi's for probably 20 years (judging by when my hair fell out), I guess having to have my thyroid removed is a blessing in disguise. No one can ever argue that I don't need meds again, though the type and amount are still up for debate. At least mine is gone gone, so unlike having Hashi's or other situations, there is no variability in how much thyroid hormone I am making. Seems like your medication levels are more difficult to regulate from that perspective.

I followed Bernstein like a maniac when I started LC in 2008. I have his diet book, his cookbook, and listen to his monthly webcasts about 75% of the time. For the record, he advocates not eating any fruit and really only a few veggies for the phytonutrient content. However, a mainstay for Bernstein and most on his diet is cheese. HWC is the only acceptable dairy product to use in coffee and is an accepted player in the recipes in his book. His position (and he gave some info from a study in his last webcast, but I tuned in too late to catch most of it) is that calories don't matter as long as you don't eat carbs. His diet has you eating about 24 a day. Someone even posed a question about eating butter and whether that would be OK since it should be a good energy source. He said you can eat a bunch of butter, but it won't provide much energy and as long as you don't eat carbs, it won't be metabolized. So, anyway, I wanted to be clear on the dairy/carb issue...there aren't many carbs in those high-fat or high-protein dairy products, though they stall some people's weight loss. This is not including, of course, milk, most yogurt, or even half and half, which are carbalicious.

And, lots of diabetics do OK not eating LC. Most are crazy active, which permits them to burn off carbs before it even significantly raises their blood sugar (my horse trainer is one of those and is a Type 1--I lent her my Bernstein book and it disappeared....). However, given that those of us who are thyroid-impaired are generally not hyper bunnies, LC makes a lot of sense when diabetes or prediabetes is in the picture. Ultimately whatever you choose as your management style is up to you. It is good that your friend manages his effectively and that others are understanding about adapting to his requirements.

Beautiful day now to tour Branson, MO. Well, not really....it is cloudy, but as one lady I ran into this morning said, "It's gonna be a beautiful day! 90% chance of sun!"

Have a nice weekend, girls!

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Old 04-17-2010, 12:02 PM   #118
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Nitenurse-
Oral steriods are notorious for prompting weight gain, so you should be happy that the gain was minimal. I am not as sure about cortisone shots, but when I had several of them years ago, I wasn't losing (and therefore not weighing), so I would not have noticed a gain. I'm happy this is almost over for you.

Ouis-
I hope it's the season But I'm not discouraged (even if I sound that way). I'm less now than I've ever been in my adult life (except for a short spell in 1971)--even less than I weighed at my high school graduation! So I have to keep this all in perspective. In my new clothes, I actually look like a 'normal person.'

The reason I'm so concerned is that I'm now fascinated with this entire process, especially as it relates to my old body. If I think I should be losing, and I'm not, I want to know why--for future reference, because I want to gain control of this whole weight thing.

I'm planning to eat carbs tomorrow mainly because of that article I read a while ago that suggests a carb day every 4-6 weeks to confuse the body. I'm not too sure about the leptin issue. From what I've read, the problem with the obese is not that they lack leptin. Tests have shown that they actually have too much leptin. The problem seems to be that there's some mechanism that keeps their leptin from crossing the blood/brain barrier and thus getting sufficient leptin into the brain to do its work. Thus, the carb loading to increase leptin that might work for 'normal' people (like body builders) would not work for me. Anyway, that's how I read this stuff.

Since tomorrow should be a MD for me, my carbs won't be excessive calories, just a lot of carbs.

Ing-
I guess it probably is easier to take thyroid meds if you don't have any thyroid left, but would you really be more stable? For example, part of my problem is that I know that low calorie dieting tends to suppress T3 and thus inhibit weight loss (a Catch-22 if there ever was one), but I can't lose at all unless I seriously restrict calories. Whether my T3 is partly from my thyroid or entirely from my meds, I'd still be lowering the level by eating such low calories. My point is that even if I had no thyroid, I should then be checked--does this make sense to you?

It's probably only a very low calorie eating plan (like JUDDD) that would be a problem, although since I show a loss at every visit, my endo doesn't worry about my diminishing T3--but I do. He doesn't know how difficult it is for me to register losses!

I really revere Bernstein, but I wonder about the cheese issue. I think all diabetics need to check foods to see what actually raises their BG. It's possible that some people react to cheese. I gave up dairy just as an experiment, and I feel fine without it. Occasionally if I'm out and there's cheese in a salad or an omelet, I'll eat it because I really don't think it's a problem for me, but it saves me a lot of calories because I just like cheese too much.

Last edited by Leo41; 04-17-2010 at 12:04 PM..
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Old 04-17-2010, 01:31 PM   #119
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Hi Everybody,

Good weigh-in this morning...... I am down 3 lbs this week from 183 to 180. This is long-time uncharted territory for me too. I might actually make the 175 goal I have in my siggy sometime this year. That goal was just a stab in the dark when I put it there in Jan 2008. All I was really hoping for was "normal." I am not planning on stopping there now, but when it happens, it happens.

I feel normal now too Leo, I can buy clothes with no Xs in just about any store. I'm not ashamed for people to see me have a snack. I walk into running stores or the little healthfairs they have the day before races and don't feel like someone is looking at me and thinking surely I am there to pick up something for someone else. I went into REI and tried out a bunch of backpacks and didn't feel like the clerk was wondering if I was going to have a heart attack on the side of a mountian.
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Old 04-17-2010, 02:45 PM   #120
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Hi Gina-
Great loss--3 lbs!! I'm so happy for you!

Isn't it great to feel 'normal'? I can't get used to the fact that I wear sizes that aren't 'plus' now. It seems like a miracle to me because I began this process with no specific weight or goals in mind--just to lose and get healthy. Perhaps that's why the very slow loss hasn't bothered me that much.

I had an interesting experience a few weeks ago in our hospital thrift shop. I'd found a pullover sweater that was only $2, but it had no size label on it. I went to the counter and asked the clerk if she thought it would fit me. There was a woman standing there (another customer), and she said "Fit YOU?"

I immediately cringed because I assumed she meant how dare I think I could fit into this sweater, but she continued, "Unless you've got some fat hidden away somewhere that I can't see, you'd have no problem getting into that."

She was right--it's actually large on me (but it's just for around the house), but I still think of myself as my 'former size.'
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