Thyroid tests are normal?? Are you sure?

[oow-woo]

Here is the link to the doctor's background that I am seeing (it is the page that Hartford Hospital puts up giving the background info on each dr.) http://www.harthosp.org/prs/ His name is Dr. Oberstein (found him on the Thyroid site under Top Docs in CT)
Carol

[LiLi77]

I got tested twice and once was a 3.0 and once was a 3.4 so I guess I am at the high end of "normal" but I do occasionally get symptoms and have a hard time losing anything at all. However, I seem to be doing a little better now that I am working out pretty intensely and drinking a ton of water - but I am still a very SLOW loser.

[Kellyann]

Pam and oow-woo - I don't mean to butt in here but I felt I needed to say this. I had those tests run too for prolactin, LH and FSH and they were looking for PCOS. I am very far from menopause at 29 yo. They also ran a Testosterone test but I have problems with cystic acne....and that is the only thing that came up high. For thyroid I can never seem to get them to run more than a TSH

[oow-woo]

I'm not quite sure I understand the FSH test (looked it up on the net)--as I went through the big 'M' in '97. Hoping this doctor has a good reason for doing it. I decided I may skip my meds for a few days just to try to get a new 'baseline' with this new bloodwork.


Carol

[nonstickpam107]

If you are talking about "skipping" your meds for a few days and meaning the thyroid med, than keep in mind that T4 has a half life of two WEEKS and the T3 in the Armour has a half life of a few hours.

They usually do an FSH on a post-meno woman if they are in doubt of thyroid disease being the "primary" hormone deficiency, and estradiol and estriol/estrone and progesterone test would be more accurate in oow-woo's case.

Pam

[nonstickpam107]

Oh, and I've found that if you are willing to pay the going rate for an office visit at the endo just to interview, than more power to you....but I'd be getting down to the questions "Will you go by symptoms", "Will you Rx. T3 or Armour instead of just synthetic T4 if it is warrented" and "Will you let me get my TSH down to a 1 or under before we tweak the T4 and T3" before any others now that I know what I know.

The going rate for most office visits to an endo (and I have BC/BS 100%, no deductible, but would have to pay out of pocket for interview or assessment) is around 175 dollars, with the first visit and blood work (adrenals MUST be checked first, too) around 1500 dollars. So, you really DO want to get your ferritin, estrogen, and iron levels done first (if low, they mimic hypothyroid) and then get the TSH, FT4, FT3 done either by healthcheckusa.com or your own PCP, and then go from there.

Pam

[oow-woo]

Pam- Interesting about the Estradiol test....I asked the Dr. about having that one done and his answer?" You wouldn't have any estragen left anyway since you are through the menopause and besides, would you take HRT anyway?"

Just to let you know, I did ask him about the Estradiol test....

Carol

[nonstickpam107]

Hmm, he must be the very last doc left that doesn't know the difference between bio-equivalent HRT and horse pee!!!

Or he doesn't realize that if your hormones aren't "balanced" that you can take all the thyroid hormone in the world, every different kind, in every different dose, and STILL not ever hit your "sweet spot" for your metabolic function to normalize. Ahhh, too bad!!

Pam

[oow-woo]

As I mentioned, his first words were, "you do have symptoms of hypo thyroid but it might be something else, since your TSH levels are at .01 and your T3 is high..." (I told him that I had this bloodwork taken AFTER I had taken my daily dose of thyroid that day) and that the T3 would have looked higher)-- he just sort of shrugged

He is the second Endo who said that the Estradiol test was 'useless' since I was through Meno. This is another reason I am planning to keep the appt. with the other Endo I have been waiting awhile to see (Nov 20th). I got the feeling that the Dr. yesterday does a lot of work with Diabetes --maybe he is more in tune with that ? He seemed to perk up with interest when he found out we have a dd with juvenile (type 1 diabetes). Didn't seem at all interested that my dad had Hashimoto's and his father (my grandfather) had HYPERthyroidism - had his thyroid removed....

Carol

[nonstickpam107]

Well, good luck with the "next" endo, but I would think you would have a lot better luck if you posted on the group (the one I'm at:http://nonstickpam107.ontheweb.com/ ) and at about.com and just told the state/area in which you were, the problems you are having, and just ask who is being treated in that area by a doctor (not nec. an ENDO) who is good with hormones AND thyroid.

I still don't understand "why" you would want to ditch the thyroid med either before the next visit....it will show where you are at in relationship to the other hormones, especially with T4 having a half life of a full two weeks (in other words, the med you take today, or at least the 80% part of it, isn't active on a test until two weeks goes by, and the 20% part of it will have worn off by tonight).

Pam

[oow-woo]

Pam - the reason I am considering ditching the meds for a few days is this: these dr.s are assuming because of the very low TSH, that I am not hypo! Don't they realize it is so low because I am on thyroid medication?? I figured that maybe I have to get off the stuff in order for them to acknowledge that I have hypo thyroid....
Is it possible to be 'cured' two years after having been diagnosed with Hashi's? I didn't think this was possible, but as I said, this Endo didn't even bat an eyelash when I told him that I had Hashi's--even suggested I might not even have a thyroid problem--I still do not understand the whole thing. Maybe I am just 'dense'!

BTW- about a week ago, I tried accessing your site but am not sure how it works--do you have to go on at certain times?

Thnx Pam,
Carol

[nonstickpam107]

Well, no one is calling you "dense" but going off the thyroid meds (which take months to get to level) would be a disaster for your body. But, you do what you think you have to do. That's not a good reason, and NO autoimmune disease cannot be "cured" and NO the Hashi's did not go "away".

Try this for the group: http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group...guid=135696360

I just can't see why anyone would go off a hormone because the doctors are being "dense". Nine out of every ten endo's JUST do diabetes.....you need to be asking people with thyroid disease who THEY go to. Some states are "worse" than others, and some of the best thyroid doc's do NOT accept insurance, or are a few hours travel to get to them.

You need to be seen and tested by a doc who knows what he/she is doing....and need to be seen with the med levels in your system. Your TSH would be "too low" and your T3 "too high" for ME but at your height, and age I really (this is my opinion) do not think you weigh too much, especially for someone who has Hashimoto's either. The doc might be reacting to THAT after seeing tons of folks with Hashi's NOT doing lowcarb and weighing a LOT more...think about it.

Pam

[oow-woo]

Pam - you are probably right--here I am being intimidated by yet another Endo. Here is a link to Hartford Hospital http://www.harthosp.org/prs/ if you type in Dr. Rober Oberstein under Doctors, you will see the entire background on the 'next' guy I am supposed to see on the 20th. A woman who has Hashi's had written a good report about him and posted it on the Thyroid info site. If you get a moment, would you please take a look at him? Thanks ever so much for all of your continued support. I am so frustrated.
Carol

[nonstickpam107]

As I've stated before, you need to ask when you make the appt. if the doc will Rx T3, will let you get your TSH to a good level for YOU (even if under a 1) and will the doc balance all the hormones. No matter WHAT his/her credentials say.

A lot of people who have promoted a doc on the "Top Doc's" list may have gone once, liked him/her then, and then found out later that this particular doc didn't follow up with what he/she planned on the first visit! I re-write my nomination for MY Top Doc yearly, BTW.

YES, the doc should understand that the TSH does go down with meds!! Of course....did this particular doc KNOW you were ON meds? And was he a T4-only doc?? Or a TSH only doc??

Well, I will check out this particular doc you are going to see on a couple other "check a doc out" sites, but all I saw was an "advertisement" that was written by the hospital/clinic to draw more business....they all do THAT. What might make this one better is that it says he is a metabolic doc. That sounds interesting, and so does the fact that he is relatively "new".

Pam

[oow-woo]

Just forgot to address the weight issue.... to be quite honest, I do not feel like I have to lose 25 lbs, however, according to Atkins chart and a few others (even those BMI's on the net), I am 'overweight'! I should be between 110 (I would look like a holocost victim), and 140 (more like it). So, I figure I should lose about 10-15 lbs. At this point I would settle for 8-10

[sweetpoison]

For those in the know - please give your opinion.

About 20 years ago I was diagnosed with Graves (Hyperthyroid). They removed 7/8th of my thyroid and I have been on Synthroid ever since.

My doctor just recently did a blood test and says it "indicates" that he can lower my dosage. I said NO, I have no energy now!!!

Can anyone tell anything from the following:

RANGE
T4-THYROXINE 9.7 (4.5 - 12.0)
TSH .09 (L) (0.30 - 4.00)
T-UPTAKE (%) 32.3 (22.5-36.9)


I am guessing by looking at the ranges I should be concerned with the TSH. What does that mean???? I just cant seem to understand him.


Vicki

[nonstickpam107]

Personally, MY doc wouldn't change a thing...and it's your DOC who is obsessed with JUST TSH----and where the heck is your T3 labs??? How does he know you are converting properly from T4 to T3 without doing a T3??? (T3 Uptake is just another test of T4---so if the doc thinks that's the test that measures your T3---ummmm,,,, it's NOT).

Pam

[sweetpoison]

I wondered where the T3 was also. Would the T-uptake % have anything to do with that. This is the first time in along time I actully got a copy of my blood work and he wouldnt give it to me, I went back to the lab and got it from them.

Thanks
Vicki

If the TSH is on the lower side of the scale, does that mean your thyroid is higher????

[nonstickpam107]

T3-Uptake percentage is very useful in gauging the rate at which T4 is used in the body (especially if they are looking for hyPER).

Pam

[valg]

Ow-Woo=I also have Hashimoto's and last spring I had to go off all meds (Armour then) for 4 weeks and then get fresh blood work drawn (the only move my doc made that didn't seem right to me, otherwise, he's been fantastic). He wanted to see apparantly exactly what was happening with my body with no interference with meds.
I would NOT recommend skipping your meds!!!!! I got VERY sick doing this and took a LONG time, months to stablize again.

When you're looking for a doctor to test your hormones, you also may want to explore a naturopath doctor. Some of them might be very good at testing and balancing hormones. But again, some are better than others too.

[oow-woo]

Wow Valg--thanks for the heads up--all of this input really helps.
Maybe I will just cut the dose back from 165 (I had been cut back from 180 to 165 by Dr. 'Weirdo' back in mid August)....
It was in September that I started having heavier hair loss. So I'm either on too much or not enough. However, I am at .01 TSH and high 199 T3.

Carol

[nonstickpam107]

oow-woo,

People on Armour DO have higher T3's, that's why a lot of them will cut the Armour and their doc will add in synthetic T4.

It's not a good feeling if you are too low in T4 either....I have hairloss, and my joints ache when my T4 is a lot lower than my T3.

Pam

[Paula Jayne]

How do you know if you have a thyroid problem?

[nonstickpam107]

Just do a search for "hypothyroid symptoms" and you will get a lot of hits.

If you have a lot of the symptoms, then you will need tested.

Pam

[nonstickpam107]

Bump for information.

Pam

[nobimbo]

Pam,

You had asked me to report my lab results from my recent doc visit and here they are (morning, fasting):

TSH: 1.29 (0.49-4.87)
T3 Free: 2.01 (1.44-3.04)
T4 Total: 10.39 (4.50-12.00) (T4Free was 1.2, with a range of 0.8-1.8 three weeks before on the previous tests I reported)

Iron: 35 (28-136)

I had asked for a ferritin test but the results were not listed in the report.

Antibodies test is pending.

I am continuing to take iron supplements to get my iron stores and red blood cell count back up (which was a little low on this last test, although normal on the one three weeks before).

I have found that my "hypo" symptoms are diminishing now that I have switched from Atenolol (a beta blocker for blood pressure) to Altace (an ace inhibitor). I had done a lot of research about the effects of certain beta blockers on insulin resistance and metabolic resistance, and came armed to my doc appointment with several research articles about that. My doc was clueless about this, as I am sure many others are. I am diabetic and have PCOS, and I discovered that Atenolol was the worst possible choice of a blood pressure med for me. Since weaning off the Atenolol, my body temps have gone up considerably, and I am finally losing weight again. I really think the Atenolol was interfering greatly with the job Metformin was trying to do for my insulin resistance. For those who want to read more about this, you may find these links helpful:

http://www.drmirkin.com/heart/7642.html

An Atkins message board thread about this issue:
http://forum.lowcarber.org/archive/index.php/t-127429

Pam, many thanks once again for all you do to help educate us about thyroid and thyroid-mimicking disorders.

Linda

[nonstickpam107]

Also, keep in mind that doc's also think "anywhere in range" is "ok" for iron.....just because you have a good iron level (which would be ABOVE a 70, BTW) doesn't mean you're storing it (ferritin). I had an iron level of 67, and a ferritin of 9 (!!!). That low iron level of yours is most likely contributing to your FT3 lower level, too.

When you bring the iron level back to where it should be, re-check your FT3, and also be aware that lowcarbers use of soy can sometimes also cause a lowered FT4 to FT3 conversion rate.

Pam

230/115/115

[nobimbo]

Pam,

I finally got the results of my antibodies tests yesterday. My doc ran two different tests, and I don't know the exact names of each. The result of one was "less than 10", the result of the other was 53. I am aware that 60 is the cut off point, but I am wondering if the 53 is anything to be concerned about, since it is on the high side. Could that, along with my sort of low Free T3, indicate a possible problem in the future? Also, why would my body be producing any antibodies at all? I understand that numbers over 60 indicate thyroiditis, but what do numbers below that mean? Do you have any links that could help explain these tests to me?

Linda