P3~P4 SIMEONS PROTOCOL SEPTEMBER 2012

[buttah]

Sorry to post three times in a row, but here are some excerpts from Robin regarding "hunger" in P3 and P4 that I posted in the Labor Day thread. I find them to be very helpful, or at least I WILL.

Loading - Labor Day 2012?

[dawnyama]

Julie--what a difference a day makes LOL!!!! I am thinking of stopping my drops for now. I took my last dose this morning and will be eating P3 on Sunday. We are going out to eat and I want to have some food LOL. Depending on how well I am doing, how I feel and if TOM comes I will hop back into P2. If I feel I can stay at my LDW of 121.6 from today with no issues whatsoever I will stick to P3 and P4 and THEN determine if I want to get to goal or not. I have a lot to think about this weekend, but mostly I want a bit of a break. I really do want some fat back in my food---it is what I miss most in P2.

I love all this talk about how to do P3/P4 because when I started my hcg journey I was alone and this forum was just a long running thread and no one had found "the way" to keep the weight off!!! Now I have hope I can stay here this time around!!! I am quite excited to try this for life, and it is great, isn't it Julie??!!!

[Reddy]

Yay Dawn! Excited for you to move to P3!

[julieboolie]

Reddy-cookies? On P3? That'll do it . Although the cold is a likely culprit too. Hope you feel well enough to enjoy your weekend!

Originally Posted by dawnyama

Julie--what a difference a day makes LOL!!!! I am thinking of stopping my drops for now. I took my last dose this morning and will be eating P3 on Sunday. We are going out to eat and I want to have some food LOL. Depending on how well I am doing, how I feel and if TOM comes I will hop back into P2. If I feel I can stay at my LDW of 121.6 from today with no issues whatsoever I will stick to P3 and P4 and THEN determine if I want to get to goal or not. I have a lot to think about this weekend, but mostly I want a bit of a break. I really do want some fat back in my food---it is what I miss most in P2.

I love all this talk about how to do P3/P4 because when I started my hcg journey I was alone and this forum was just a long running thread and no one had found "the way" to keep the weight off!!! Now I have hope I can stay here this time around!!! I am quite excited to try this for life, and it is great, isn't it Julie??!!!

Good for you! When you're on too long, and the losses slow, I always worry about depletion and then rebound eating and gaining. Glad you'll at least interrupt. Lots of theories and ideas on how to do stabilization and lifetime maintenance. Lots of people fighting the good fight right along with us . I totally agree that it's exciting!! I hope we always feel this way!

Buttah-I didn't literally mean a JUDDD UD. I was using that term loosely to mean a day when one eats higher cals than "normal". Not JUDDD per se. I understand the idea of only eating to hunger, and ITA that learning what that looks and feels like is hard, ESP when you don't trust your body yet. The concern I have is carb sensitivity and its link to hunger. I've been LC for 9+ years, and the hunger management it gives is priceless. Once I'm eating higher carbs the hunger increases, which would lead me to eat more than I'd technically need. Ideally leptin sensitivity is perfect and hunger results in perfect caloric intake and balance. But, realistically as people with obesity issues, I doubt I'll ever be able to just eat to hunger. Frankly, off LC, I don't trust my hunger. Maybe that'll be different once I get there and get used to my "new, smaller" body. We'll see. But, I think, for me, there will always need to be a control over hunger and food choices. I will likely always weigh often. I've worked too hard, for too long, to allow room for error and regain. But that's just me. Many folks can eat plentiful carbs w/o increased hunger. That would be ideal. But unfortunately, I doubt I'll ever get that lucky. I can listen to hunger and eat accordingly, but there will need to be a cap on it.

[buttah]

"I doubt I'll ever be able to just eat to hunger."

I've heard you say that a few times. I just wonder... Why? Is quantity really that much more important than quality? I was overweight for years (only about 10-20 lbs) and yet, I lost and maintained that way (just eating to hunger) for nearly 20 years until I got pregnant the first time. (Of course that doesn't mean I can DO IT AGAIN!) I suspect that if you truly doubt that you can "just eat to hunger," you will likely need a more structured way of eating for lifetime maintenance (and the same may be true for me). Occasionally eating past hunger always corrects itself when you get right back on the hunger scale wagon. But if you don't, the HS probably just isn't for you. JUDDD may be a great option, though. But that's not for everyone either. But it has the most DEVOUT and happy maintainers I've seen in any forum.

We all gotta find our way, though. The good thing is learning from the past, which it sounds like most of us are committed to.

[Reddy]

Yeah Julie it was a dumb choice. I ate two of these little cookies. But I suppose it could have been enough to tip the scale! I'm supposed to enter p4 next week but will stay low carb for the most part.

I have a feeling Monday will be a correction day as I will definitely be out of my window after this weekend.

[C'Marie]

@Julie, the 2 x a week fasting plan is something you read about occasionally that people do, 5 days of "regular" eating and 2x "fasting" which can be 500 cals or less, or around 25% of normal cals, I guess, to technically be considered fasting. You get the same thing when you do UP days, DD, and throw in a medium day here or there. I am committed to do 2 great DD a week, Mon/Wed, and then fri/sat I usually flip flop Med/Med so that I am always on UD Sunday, DD Mon, UD Tuesday because of school at night. But sometimes I do just eat "light" Fri, UD saturday, md on Sunday - whatever - just so that I always do DD Mon/Wed. Sometimes, however, I just don't get it quite right. And sometimes I just plow through and instead of an UP on Tuesday I do a Medium. How's that? LOL I think if you google 2 day fasting a week there's plans that pop up. I think people do them for a variety of reasons.

[shelbyla]

Originally Posted by buttah

1 - "I doubt I'll ever be able to just eat to hunger."

I've heard you say that a few times. I just wonder... Why? Is quantity really that much more important than quality?

2 - JUDDD may be a great option, though. But that's not for everyone either. But it has the most DEVOUT and happy maintainers I've seen in any forum.

3 - We all gotta find our way, though. The good thing is learning from the past, which it sounds like most of us are committed to.

This may be a bit of a rant so bear with me. Buttah, this is not directed at you specifically. Value your opinions as always...

1 - I have the same issue as Julie--and I think the answer FOR ME is that regardless of how many times you (or anyone else) posts the description of the hunger scale, it's just not as easy as matching the words on the page to what I am feeling. I've asked over and over again if what I am feeling is actually eating to the hunger scale but no one seems to answer me (not just you buttah but any of the WLA disciples on here). Everyone just posts the hunger scale words--AGAIN. I've posted on Robin's page--no one answers me there either. Maybe it's easy for some people but it's VERY MUCH NOT EASY for me to tell the difference between a 5 and a 6 which is the exact tipping point that we are talking about here.

I also don't think this is a "quantity rather than quality" issue. It's not that I want to eat bad food in large quantities (mostly) as opposed to good in small quantities. I almost ALWAYS eat at home, healthy, whole foods, cooked myself, with the best ingredients that I can afford. But it tastes DAMN good (if I do say so myself!) so it's not a matter of quantity vs. quality. I RARELY stuff myself (even on holidays) but the difference between being "not hungry" and just being "done eating" continues to elude me.

Like Julie, I struggle with eating carbs in any quantities (some are worse than others) as eating them AT ALL increases my appetite for more. And it's true hunger, not just cravings or head hunger. The second I have that sugar or wheat, I want moremoremore and even after I stop eating, I get hungry within minutes again--not hours. I've had this happen over and over and it's not just my imagination.

2 - I tried JUDDD as well. I really really did. I didn't try to overeat on my UDs. I kept pretty strict DDs (<600 calories and many times completely fasted). It just didn't work for me, socially. More than hCG, I found JUDDD to be socially restrictive, always requiring DDs to be on certain days, which I can't really plan my schedule around very well. At least with hCG, it's for a limited time. The minute I went off of the strict rotations, I gained back everything I had lost and then some. It didn't work for maintaining for me at all. In addition, I have serious doubts about the health benefits of training your body to expect an average of 1200-1500 calories daily. I also don't see how being hungry reconciles with the WLA hunger scale OR with many of the other studies on Leptin and Leptin resistance (a la Jack Kruse). There are studies to back up everything including JUDDD and hCG and low fat so regardless of the books or articles or theories, until someone sits down and does a serious double blind study, we aren't going to know how, what and why hormones do what they do. The JUDDD people here are lovely--very very warm and welcoming--but they are certainly not the only happy and successful maintainers around. I've been on a lot of forums over the years as well and have seen various degrees of success with each. I have found that if something stops working, often those people will disappear from the forums so that may be why we see great maintainers on the LCF JUDDD forum. We are also going to see a lot of repeaters with hCG because it is fast, effective and relatively easy for someone with any degree of willpower. Easier than Weight Watchers where you lose 4 pounds a month. Easier than low carb where you stall out FOREVER and can't have fruit!

3 - Agree 100%. It's looking back and not expecting different results from the same behavior that is really the key. If we go back to eating "normally" (whatever that is), we will probably end up exactly where we started. hCG or no hCG. This is my problem with a lot of the rogue deviations--I'm not talking about adding broccoli or whatever but the serious deviations. Go rogue or don't--it's totally your choice. But I haven't seen a whole lot of luck with maintaining after a rogue plan. If you don't follow the plan, you can't really expect the results that Simeons saw over time. Either on the hCG or afterwards. JMHO

//end rant//

[buttah]

Shelby, first of all, when I reference "quality," I wasn't talking about healthy foods necessarily. I was talking about whatever it is that one desires to eat. Healthy or unhealthy. I was talking about eating your "pleaser," not your "teaser." If your pleaser is a piece of pizza, that that's "quality." I love some really fattening foods that are not quantitatively healthy. The trick is eating them in small portions on occasion, when you really want them. That's what I meant by quality not quantity. Not having more veggies when what you really want is a small piece of desert. I wasn't making any statement or judgement that one should eat healthy in maintenance. The beauty of the HS, if it works for you, is that you eat what your heart desires. But you don't overeat it. At least not often. That was what I meant by "quality." Something really yummy and tasty and satisfying, whatever it is, is not necessarily better just cuz you eat more of it. You know? Does another bite or two or ten or twenty make it better? No.

2. Of course the detractors disappear when things don't go well, or when they lose the need for the support of a forum. I was just saying that the level of happiness on the JUDDD forum, for those who do post there, is palpable. As is the "calm" regarding the scale, and the idea that over-induglences take care of themselves over the course of time. Which is very "way of life, " if you know what I mean. I don't find that on other WOE's. There I do see many, many people disappear. Just an observation. I certainly haven't visited every diet forum or sub-category.

I am done trying to explain the HS or Robin's theories. Really really done. But as I give that up, let me say that the amount of misinterpretation and misunderstanding of what she preaches is huge here. Just huge. And as one of the only people here who has worked with her directly (and did another HS program years ago and found it LIFE CHANGING), I thought I'd try to clear some of that up. I officially will stop now. I also think many people (not you or anyone specific) are attached to the idea, for whatever reason, of future over-indulgences on a level that will always need correcting or re-dieting. If anyone has any questions, PM me. I'm sorry Robin hasn't answered your questions. Try messaging her on the site. That worked for me and is how we first "met."

4. I don't consider myself a rogue at all on P2. The most I have done is add an ounce of protein, eliminate a fruit and have an extra spear of asparagus, and done one "shake day" on Robin's clinic's approval. That's it. Not sure if you were addressing me there. If you weren't, never mind.

[buttah]

And one last thing, Robin is well aware of intermittent fasting studies regarding inflammation and other health benefits (the reduction in my inflammation from JUDDD was staggering - my doctor flipped out), and there is nothing in that research that she feels contradicts the many leptin studies at all. It's the "intermittent" that's key. (She is also a huge fan and promoter of Jack Kruse - and visa versa. Their work is completely reconcilable!) Okay, done done.

[julieboolie]

Originally Posted by C'Marie

@Julie, the 2 x a week fasting plan is something you read about occasionally that people do, 5 days of "regular" eating and 2x "fasting" which can be 500 cals or less, or around 25% of normal cals, I guess, to technically be considered fasting. You get the same thing when you do UP days, DD, and throw in a medium day here or there. I am committed to do 2 great DD a week, Mon/Wed, and then fri/sat I usually flip flop Med/Med so that I am always on UD Sunday, DD Mon, UD Tuesday because of school at night. But sometimes I do just eat "light" Fri, UD saturday, md on Sunday - whatever - just so that I always do DD Mon/Wed. Sometimes, however, I just don't get it quite right. And sometimes I just plow through and instead of an UP on Tuesday I do a Medium. How's that? LOL I think if you google 2 day fasting a week there's plans that pop up. I think people do them for a variety of reasons.

Thanks! That makes sense. Kinda' like a modified JUDDD w/ only 2 DD's a week? Gotcha! Like all plans, you have to make it your own and live life while doing it. Looks like it's gone well for you!

Originally Posted by shelbyla

This may be a bit of a rant so bear with me. Buttah, this is not directed at you specifically. Value your opinions as always...

1 - I have the same issue as Julie--and I think the answer FOR ME is that regardless of how many times you (or anyone else) posts the description of the hunger scale, it's just not as easy as matching the words on the page to what I am feeling. I've asked over and over again if what I am feeling is actually eating to the hunger scale but no one seems to answer me (not just you buttah but any of the WLA disciples on here). Everyone just posts the hunger scale words--AGAIN. I've posted on Robin's page--no one answers me there either. Maybe it's easy for some people but it's VERY MUCH NOT EASY for me to tell the difference between a 5 and a 6 which is the exact tipping point that we are talking about here.

I also don't think this is a "quantity rather than quality" issue. It's not that I want to eat bad food in large quantities (mostly) as opposed to good in small quantities. I almost ALWAYS eat at home, healthy, whole foods, cooked myself, with the best ingredients that I can afford. But it tastes DAMN good (if I do say so myself!) so it's not a matter of quantity vs. quality. I RARELY stuff myself (even on holidays) but the difference between being "not hungry" and just being "done eating" continues to elude me.

Like Julie, I struggle with eating carbs in any quantities (some are worse than others) as eating them AT ALL increases my appetite for more. And it's true hunger, not just cravings or head hunger. The second I have that sugar or wheat, I want moremoremore and even after I stop eating, I get hungry within minutes again--not hours. I've had this happen over and over and it's not just my imagination.

2 - I tried JUDDD as well. I really really did. I didn't try to overeat on my UDs. I kept pretty strict DDs (<600 calories and many times completely fasted). It just didn't work for me, socially. More than hCG, I found JUDDD to be socially restrictive, always requiring DDs to be on certain days, which I can't really plan my schedule around very well. At least with hCG, it's for a limited time. The minute I went off of the strict rotations, I gained back everything I had lost and then some. It didn't work for maintaining for me at all. In addition, I have serious doubts about the health benefits of training your body to expect an average of 1200-1500 calories daily. I also don't see how being hungry reconciles with the WLA hunger scale OR with many of the other studies on Leptin and Leptin resistance (a la Jack Kruse). There are studies to back up everything including JUDDD and hCG and low fat so regardless of the books or articles or theories, until someone sits down and does a serious double blind study, we aren't going to know how, what and why hormones do what they do. The JUDDD people here are lovely--very very warm and welcoming--but they are certainly not the only happy and successful maintainers around. I've been on a lot of forums over the years as well and have seen various degrees of success with each. I have found that if something stops working, often those people will disappear from the forums so that may be why we see great maintainers on the LCF JUDDD forum. We are also going to see a lot of repeaters with hCG because it is fast, effective and relatively easy for someone with any degree of willpower. Easier than Weight Watchers where you lose 4 pounds a month. Easier than low carb where you stall out FOREVER and can't have fruit!

3 - Agree 100%. It's looking back and not expecting different results from the same behavior that is really the key. If we go back to eating "normally" (whatever that is), we will probably end up exactly where we started. hCG or no hCG. This is my problem with a lot of the rogue deviations--I'm not talking about adding broccoli or whatever but the serious deviations. Go rogue or don't--it's totally your choice. But I haven't seen a whole lot of luck with maintaining after a rogue plan. If you don't follow the plan, you can't really expect the results that Simeons saw over time. Either on the hCG or afterwards. JMHO

//end rant//

Well put, and it's kinda' nice to know I'm not alone in my struggle. Figuring all of that 5-6 and then getting hungry sooner than the next meal, etc., is more work than I really think is worth it. For me. I am not unhappy living basically LC, w. occasional indulgences. I think balancing that w. normal LC eating will yeild success. I also didn't do well w. JUDDD, but it works great for many. It's been a long journey, for both of us, and I think we're really in the home stretch of maintaining our current new low weights () while living life. Balancing, correcting if necessary, and learning. Giving and receiving grace while we figure it all out is important.

Originally Posted by buttah

"I doubt I'll ever be able to just eat to hunger."

I've heard you say that a few times. I just wonder... Why? Is quantity really that much more important than quality? I was overweight for years (only about 10-20 lbs) and yet, I lost and maintained that way (just eating to hunger) for nearly 20 years until I got pregnant the first time. (Of course that doesn't mean I can DO IT AGAIN!) I suspect that if you truly doubt that you can "just eat to hunger," you will likely need a more structured way of eating for lifetime maintenance (and the same may be true for me). Occasionally eating past hunger always corrects itself when you get right back on the hunger scale wagon. But if you don't, the HS probably just isn't for you. JUDDD may be a great option, though. But that's not for everyone either. But it has the most DEVOUT and happy maintainers I've seen in any forum.

We all gotta find our way, though. The good thing is learning from the past, which it sounds like most of us are committed to.

I appreciate that you want to help. I am certainly not an expert at any of this, just one more person figuring out what works best for me. I'm not sure that you understand my challenges. Losing 130+lbs has been quite a journey for me. I have learned a lot along the way. I am not done learning, but I am getting closer to figuring things out more quickly. Like you say, you'll have to do the HS once you're "done" and see how it works for you "now". I have tried listening to "hunger" in the past, and it has not worked well for me. For whatever reason, it wasn't effective. Just because it didn't work for me, doesn't villianize the plan. I certainly don't mean for you to take it personally that I am not successful w. HS. It's no failure on your part in explaining or demonstrating the success of the HS for you. I like to feel free to work out what I'm learning, trying, failing and experimenting with here with my LCFs. What works for one, doesn't always work for others. I don't want you to stop sharing what's working for you. Many here are looking forward to incorporating the HS into their plans, and truly value your insight into Robin's program. Just like you're looking to JUDDD to be your next WOE, I'm not recommending LC as the better option for you. It's what works, for me. But JUDDD and HS are your plans of choice. That's good. It's different than what I'm choosing for me. Please allow me to figure things out for myself without having to always chime in reminding me of what Robin says. I'm not ranting, and don't want to offend you, but feel like my opinion and experience are also valuable. I've maintained 100+lbs of weight loss for 9 years. I'd call that a level of success. I'm working out how to maintain the last 30lbs now. For some reason this last amount is tougher. But, I'm not giving up.

Sorry, that got long. Just wanted to say my piece. I hope you're not upset with me.

[buttah]

Julie, I just typed you a long response and my computer ate it.

So I will try to recap. First of all, I am so not upset with you, and I never was upset with you. I'm sorry if I've made you upset with me. I also didn't mean to bug you by bringing up Robin or the HS too often. Yes, I do try to correct the frequent mischaracterizations of Robin's theories and advice, because they occur here so often, but that's clearly bothering some people, so I will stop, like I said. I was only trying to be helpful.

More important, I have not maintained zip yet. Not in recent history anyhow. Unless you count my four month plateau on my journey since February (but that wasn't on purpose), I have all of my maintenance ahead of me. So I certainly can't and don't begrudge anyone the right to figure it out for themselves. I don't have any answers. That is why I said everyone has to find their own way (the part you bolded). We all have our own journeys - You are correct that I can only understand yours to a degree, and visa versa. I thought that was why we all shared our experiences here.

As for LC (or low glycemic, at least), I don't need anyone to recommend it to me, as I have eaten that way for years. While I was still staying overweight, I ate that way (it's possible to be fat and eat LC). When I began my WL journey (as you can see to the left in my little profile), I ate that way. When I switched to JUDDD, I ate that way (even on UD's for the most part), and when I am at goal, I will eat that way. For no other reason than I truly FEEL BETTER when I don't eat bread, potatoes, corn, rice, cereal, etc. Once in a blue moon I have some of those things, but not often.

I haven't even decided what I'm doing when I "leave" HCG. I know it will incorporate the HS. I may do JUDDD. I may not. I'm glad I have experience with both. I just think going forward I'll let others share their experience and keep mine to myself. And that's okay.

[C'Marie]

Love you all. Every experience and point of view is valid and valued. We all have things to learn from each other

[dawnyama]

Originally Posted by C'Marie

Love you all. Every experience and point of view is valid and valued. We all have things to learn from each other

If we don't share our experiences then no learning can take place. That is how I learn anyhow!! By having others who have gone before me to model after. I have learned a whole lot from this forum and value everyone's opinion. And experiences!!

[julieboolie]

Originally Posted by buttah

Julie, I just typed you a long response and my computer ate it.

So I will try to recap. First of all, I am so not upset with you, and I never was upset with you. I'm sorry if I've made you upset with me. I also didn't mean to bug you by bringing up Robin or the HS too often. Yes, I do try to correct the frequent mischaracterizations of Robin's theories and advice, because they occur here so often, but that's clearly bothering some people, so I will stop, like I said. I was only trying to be helpful.

More important, I have not maintained zip yet. Not in recent history anyhow. Unless you count my four month plateau on my journey since February (but that wasn't on purpose), I have all of my maintenance ahead of me. So I certainly can't and don't begrudge anyone the right to figure it out for themselves. I don't have any answers. That is why I said everyone has to find their own way (the part you bolded). We all have our own journeys - You are correct that I can only understand yours to a degree, and visa versa. I thought that was why we all shared our experiences here.

As for LC (or low glycemic, at least), I don't need anyone to recommend it to me, as I have eaten that way for years. While I was still staying overweight, I ate that way (it's possible to be fat and eat LC). When I began my WL journey (as you can see to the left in my little profile), I ate that way. When I switched to JUDDD, I ate that way (even on UD's for the most part), and when I am at goal, I will eat that way. For no other reason than I truly FEEL BETTER when I don't eat bread, potatoes, corn, rice, cereal, etc. Once in a blue moon I have some of those things, but not often.

I haven't even decided what I'm doing when I "leave" HCG. I know it will incorporate the HS. I may do JUDDD. I may not. I'm glad I have experience with both. I just think going forward I'll let others share their experience and keep mine to myself. And that's okay.

I'm glad you're not upset with me and you understand. I too stalled out on LC after a while, but love it for maintenance. Please share your experiences. That's very valuable to all of us, and to yourself. As you're working through all of that. You're entirely correct that we each need to find our own ways. Challenging one another's hunger or experience w. things they've tried can be off-putting. But sharing what we're learning through our own experience is invaluable!

Dawn and Marie-well put!!

I'm down 1.2 overnight. Not sure why, but happy to see it. Ate out last night, had a great date w. dh! He got me roses, bought and booked me a massage (it did get rescheduled, but still the thought was lovely!!) and took me out for bacon wrapped filet mignon then an amazing breve latte! It was a great date!! And I'm down today? Bonus!!

Have a great day all!! I'm off to get dressed and pack the cooler. We're heading out for some Fall foliage and a nice hike!

[julieboolie]

How're you all doing today? I'm at LDW-0.2, which is a happy place to be!! THat's with eating out twice this weekend! I'll be adding eggs this coming week, which had been a challenge for me last P3. So far, cottage cheese and GY have been good breakfast options. I like those Quest protein bars. Tried them the past 2 days, and they're tasty and haven't stalled me yet.

[Reddy]

Quick stop by bc
This weekend has been nuts- I'm .2 over LDW this morning which isn't too bad considering that Friday night I drank quite a bit and even ate a corn dog! (I know I know - alcOhol = poor choices for me) yesterday I also had a few beers at the party as well as a few bites of a cupcake which was also bad but in my defense they offered nothing but pretzels And pizza and I was hungry yet I still resisted. So... With a few cheats I think I'm ok and hope
To be back down in the window reAlly soon!

One more challenge today because we're having lunch with an old
Friend of my hubby - I may have one drink but I'll get a salad
Or something so it shouldn't be terrible.

Julie so happy to see you're doing so well with maintenance! You're killing it!!!

Ok gotta run! Hope everyone is great!

[C'Marie]

I am LIW +3 at this moment. Enjoying an in-control UD and a strict DD tomorrow and Wednesday. I'll weigh again Thursday, if I don't before. I think after this week's rotations I may have to get tougher to go down any further than LIW +2. We will see!

[julieboolie]

Marie-what week are you completing? You've been through P3 and P4 for a while now, right? Are you planning to lose more weight w. JUDDD? I'm curious how it'll work for you once you tighten those DD's. Very interesting. I wasn't successful with it, but I also wasn't willing to do it LC when I treid it. I wonder if it'd work for losing for me, if I did it LC. On the "back burner" should I ever decide to try to lose more weight .

Reddy-Do you mean 0.2 over the window or over LDW? That's mighty fine for that weekend!! Hope you finish well tomorrow morning too . I think the overarching goal of P3 is to lock in that LDW +/- 2lbs. If you can do it w. beer etc. that's quite a success, in my book!! It's nice to be slim AND live your life a bit more freely!!

Today's menu: 5 guys small cheeseburger, no bun and had scrambled egg and a thick slice of bacon for breakfast. Decided to try experimenting with the eggs today. Had my leftover pork chop for dinner, with a big salad and am now enjoying my decaf coffee. I had 2 Quest bars today. They're actually pretty tasty, very low carb and high fiber, 20g protein each. They got me through a lunch "meeting" at Taco Bell and a meeting around 4Pm. Cals and ratios coming in fine (around where they've been the past few days). So we'll see. I feel like I'm waiting to exhale. I've been eating out all weekend, carefully, but still out. I added eggs today, which I suspected stalled me last round. So, if I'm up significantly tomorrow I'll have that as my main suspect.

[C'Marie]

Oh gosh, Julie, I'm well into P4. I just am trying to maintain at this point, but if I decide to go back into weightloss mode with JUDDD, I may evict a few more pounds. My stress at school and work is such that I'd rather just keep things as they are. My understanding of JUDDD, however, is that people CAN lose while not having to be LC. I tend to stay at least wheat free at this time for health. I also stay as grain free as possible, and LC except I will have the occasional regular frozen yogurt (sugar)..... and fruit once in awhile. In fact, on my UD today, I had 2 servings of chocolate frozen yogurt with pecan bits. Hopefully I stay in my UD calorie amount

[Reddy]

Julie it was .2 out of window.

Today it's 1.2 out of window so I'm going to do a steak day.

I'll have one at lunch and one at dinner and hopefully that will do it!

[LaraSuzz]

Hi all... had a great weekend... but went out to eat yesterday and I was within my window and now I'm up 3.4. Dunno where the hack that came from but I will do a coffee bacon day casue I hate steak days on monday and I dont want to take any prisoners this morning.

[Reddy]

Lara I love the new pic! You're so beautiful!

I'm debating a steak day or just a really clean eating mosty meat day....

[LaraSuzz]

Originally Posted by Reddy

Lara I love the new pic! You're so beautiful!

I'm debating a steak day or just a really clean eating mosty meat day....

wow thank you We could try just meat day and see... I think its water retention... sometimes I feel like CD;s are rough and I dont wanna do the bouncy bounce up then down... I dont think my body likes CD's and from doing high fat meat and maybe skipping dinner its possible to loose 2 lbs without wanting to jump "out" of the window hardy har. Hail to the bacon Gods

[julieboolie]

First- I'l give a shout out to bacon !!

Originally Posted by Reddy

Julie it was .2 out of window.

Today it's 1.2 out of window so I'm going to do a steak day.

I'll have one at lunch and one at dinner and hopefully that will do it!

That's not too shabby, and you know it's just water retention. But I know you like to be at or below LDW, me too . So I'll wish you a nice whoosh today!!

Originally Posted by LaraSuzz

Hi all... had a great weekend... but went out to eat yesterday and I was within my window and now I'm up 3.4. Dunno where the hack that came from but I will do a coffee bacon day casue I hate steak days on monday and I dont want to take any prisoners this morning.

Lookin' good GF!! The skipping dinner thing is key for you. Seems like you can eat clean, mostly whatever you like P3 style, and skip dinner and you'll be back down. I love that P3 teaches each of us what our bodies like best! You're doing great. How's the boy department?

I'm up 0.6 to LDW+0.6 today. But that's just fine. I ate out all weekend, albeit controlled. I also had a LOT of salad late last night, and 2 protein bars yesterday (17g of fiber each! ) So, I'm guessing there's a fiber party in my belly today . Not sweating it. Gonna' keep it clean and homemade all day. Wondering about the eggs. It would seem if I was sensitive to them I'd have a big jump up, right? Isn't that how food sensitivities present? Help a girl out here. I'm not sure I know what to look for, truthfully. I want eggs to be "ok" for me .

So far, so good . I can't believe I leave for Mexico on Sat. morning. I've got to do some laundry. I'm taking all my "too big" jeans. At least 2 pairs will be destroyed, so that's ok. Dd(12) is scheming to take some of my jeans too. Little rascal. It's ok. I was going to donate them anyway. At least now, with a good belt, they'll have a good purpose .

Looking forward to a nice, quiet, stable week!!

[Reddy]

Originally Posted by LaraSuzz

wow thank you We could try just meat day and see... I think its water retention... sometimes I feel like CD;s are rough and I dont wanna do the bouncy bounce up then down... I dont think my body likes CD's and from doing high fat meat and maybe skipping dinner its possible to loose 2 lbs without wanting to jump "out" of the window hardy har. Hail to the bacon Gods

LOL. I like the sound of a "meat day" I"m such a carnivore! I agree that CD's can be tough and may be too much yo yo ing. I have only done one so far in P3 and technically tomorrow starts P4 (though I'm sticking with mostly P3) so that's why I figured Id do one but I don't like relying on them.

I'm thinking I'll have a burger or something like that for lunch. Then a big steak and maybe a little broccoli for dinner. No snacking in between no nuts, or fruit or anything. Oh and lots of coffee. I am sure that will get me back down tomorrow.

Originally Posted by julieboolie

First- I'l give a shout out to bacon !!


That's not too shabby, and you know it's just water retention. But I know you like to be at or below LDW, me too . So I'll wish you a nice whoosh today!!



Lookin' good GF!! The skipping dinner thing is key for you. Seems like you can eat clean, mostly whatever you like P3 style, and skip dinner and you'll be back down. I love that P3 teaches each of us what our bodies like best! You're doing great. How's the boy department?

I'm up 0.6 to LDW+0.6 today. But that's just fine. I ate out all weekend, albeit controlled. I also had a LOT of salad late last night, and 2 protein bars yesterday (17g of fiber each! ) So, I'm guessing there's a fiber party in my belly today . Not sweating it. Gonna' keep it clean and homemade all day. Wondering about the eggs. It would seem if I was sensitive to them I'd have a big jump up, right? Isn't that how food sensitivities present? Help a girl out here. I'm not sure I know what to look for, truthfully. I want eggs to be "ok" for me .

So far, so good . I can't believe I leave for Mexico on Sat. morning. I've got to do some laundry. I'm taking all my "too big" jeans. At least 2 pairs will be destroyed, so that's ok. Dd(12) is scheming to take some of my jeans too. Little rascal. It's ok. I was going to donate them anyway. At least now, with a good belt, they'll have a good purpose .

Looking forward to a nice, quiet, stable week!!

I agree it's just water retention and for the way I ate this weekend, I don't think that's bad at all. I had beer Friday, Sat AND Sunday and I also had more carbs than I should have so being up a little is to be expected. I'm sure a clean day will get me back in. But yes, I would LOVE to be at or below LDW. So far this P3, I have not managed to be below LDW (like I was in R1) but that's b/c each weekend has = gain. But I"m not worried about it b/c I feel like I"m doing well all around.

You are doing great Julie with your maintainance so far! .6 over LDW is nothing. Esp with eating out!!! I'm sure you'd like to get below before Mexico and I"m sure you will and even if not, you'll do fine while you're there b/c you will make good choices! I am sure you've said it already, and I know it's a mission trip, but where in Mexico are you going?

[julieboolie]

Originally Posted by C'Marie

Oh gosh, Julie, I'm well into P4. I just am trying to maintain at this point, but if I decide to go back into weightloss mode with JUDDD, I may evict a few more pounds. My stress at school and work is such that I'd rather just keep things as they are. My understanding of JUDDD, however, is that people CAN lose while not having to be LC. I tend to stay at least wheat free at this time for health. I also stay as grain free as possible, and LC except I will have the occasional regular frozen yogurt (sugar)..... and fruit once in awhile. In fact, on my UD today, I had 2 servings of chocolate frozen yogurt with pecan bits. Hopefully I stay in my UD calorie amount

Sorry, forgot to reply to this! That's how I like to eat too. I don't consider a bit of fruit or froyo high carb. It's certainly part of my LC maintenance lifestyle. They're the 2 higher carb indulgences (with a bit of chocolate thrown in too) that I enjoy. It also doesn't seem to impact the scale as much, which is a bonus! With all the stresses in your life, maintaining is enough of a challenge! I thought you'd been at it for a while. You're doing great!!
Yes, the appeal of JUDDD, to me, was that I could eat more "normal" on the UDs. The "sacrifice" that every WOE has is what causes the scale to go down. So the "sacrifice" of DD's every other day, were suppposed to be compensated with UDs that include more carbs (for me). Unfortunately, that's not how it went for me. Sigh. To do LC JUDDD just seems like double sacrifice . I guess if I'm really looking to lose a bit more I'll give it a shot eventually. I think I'd do Atkins induction first though, to see if I could lose on that nowadays. I am not planning to lose more, but was curious to see how you were JUDDDing.

Originally Posted by Reddy

LOL. I like the sound of a "meat day" I"m such a carnivore! I agree that CD's can be tough and may be too much yo yo ing. I have only done one so far in P3 and technically tomorrow starts P4 (though I'm sticking with mostly P3) so that's why I figured Id do one but I don't like relying on them.

I'm thinking I'll have a burger or something like that for lunch. Then a big steak and maybe a little broccoli for dinner. No snacking in between no nuts, or fruit or anything. Oh and lots of coffee. I am sure that will get me back down tomorrow.

I agree it's just water retention and for the way I ate this weekend, I don't think that's bad at all. I had beer Friday, Sat AND Sunday and I also had more carbs than I should have so being up a little is to be expected. I'm sure a clean day will get me back in. But yes, I would LOVE to be at or below LDW. So far this P3, I have not managed to be below LDW (like I was in R1) but that's b/c each weekend has = gain. But I"m not worried about it b/c I feel like I"m doing well all around.

You are doing great Julie with your maintainance so far! .6 over LDW is nothing. Esp with eating out!!! I'm sure you'd like to get below before Mexico and I"m sure you will and even if not, you'll do fine while you're there b/c you will make good choices! I am sure you've said it already, and I know it's a mission trip, but where in Mexico are you going?

You have had a lot of social stuff on the weekends. Truthfully, with all of that, you're doing quite well. You should be happy and proud of yourself. I'm thankfully getting a small repreive in social temptation! It's coming though . I too wonder about CDs as a true helpful tool. I've had unsuccessful ones, and regains. I am leaning toward clean P3 days as equally effective. I guess it depends on the cause of the gain? If it's temporary insanity (cookies, beer, wine, sugar, french fries) one day then maybe 1 CD is the right response? But if it's gradual creep, I don't think a CD is as effective. These are my P3 musings .
Thanks. Yes, I'd really like to be below LDW when I leave on Saturday. I fully expect, even w. careful planning, packing and dining, to be up a bit when I return. I'm allowed to bring my own cooler now (we're brining a little trailer so there'll be enough room! ) so I'll be bringing my beloved Voskos along for meals, which will make me feel "safe". We're going to Ensenda (I posted a link to the mission in my journal, linked below if you're interested). It's about a 9 hour drive from here.
We'll be building the second "half" of a house in 4 days time. There's also a shelter there we'll be visitng. Should be a full and challenging week .

I'm chatty!! I'm gonna' go try bullet proof coffee!!

[LaraSuzz]

Originally Posted by julieboolie

First- I'l give a shout out to bacon !!


That's not too shabby, and you know it's just water retention. But I know you like to be at or below LDW, me too . So I'll wish you a nice whoosh today!!



Lookin' good GF!! The skipping dinner thing is key for you. Seems like you can eat clean, mostly whatever you like P3 style, and skip dinner and you'll be back down. I love that P3 teaches each of us what our bodies like best! You're doing great. How's the boy department?

I'm up 0.6 to LDW+0.6 today. But that's just fine. I ate out all weekend, albeit controlled. I also had a LOT of salad late last night, and 2 protein bars yesterday (17g of fiber each! ) So, I'm guessing there's a fiber party in my belly today . Not sweating it. Gonna' keep it clean and homemade all day. Wondering about the eggs. It would seem if I was sensitive to them I'd have a big jump up, right? Isn't that how food sensitivities present? Help a girl out here. I'm not sure I know what to look for, truthfully. I want eggs to be "ok" for me .

So far, so good . I can't believe I leave for Mexico on Sat. morning. I've got to do some laundry. I'm taking all my "too big" jeans. At least 2 pairs will be destroyed, so that's ok. Dd(12) is scheming to take some of my jeans too. Little rascal. It's ok. I was going to donate them anyway. At least now, with a good belt, they'll have a good purpose .

Looking forward to a nice, quiet, stable week!!

Mexico too?? lol have fun!!!! Hope for a drop tommorow fingers crossed !!

[dawnyama]

You guys are great at plugging right along!! You go!!

Julie---Sounds like you did well with your eggs!! WooHoo!!! I know that Peggy would have a huge jump up when she had almonds. It was quite noticeable. I don't know if up 0.6 is an intolerance or not. Hard to say. Sorry I am not much help dear.

Marie---you are a champ at maintaining and not freaking out!!! You are amazing!!!

Lara and Reddy--enjoy your correction days today!! Whatever they end up being LOL. Happy Monday!!

As for me, I think this is my last week on P2. I am tired of it, I am hungry and I am NOT Losing!!! I am sooo tired of seeing the same numbers pop up on the scale. So whatever happens this week will be just icing on the cake. I think my weight will be stable when I stop this round because I have been hanging around 120 for a good 5 days now. So when TOM is over, so is P2. I cannot wait!!!

[C'Marie]

Doing a strict DD today, most probably like an egg day - lotsa water, maybe eggs and turkey bacon. Maybe an egg salad..... I dunno for sure. I had too many almonds, cashews, and chocolate covered cranberries yesterday, along with pecans froyo (regular sugar kind)..... but other than that my eating was pretty small, little bit of cheese, chicken, turkey bacon. Oh, and wine can't forget the wine. Ha ha ......

Was LIW +3 before yesterday's eating, and no, I'm not freaking out, just working the program. The scale will drop eventually, or it won't. And if it doesn't, I'll move to plan B. Which is P2++ for me, no nuts which would probably be better overall. Or one ounce at a time, not the nutfest I did yesterday LOL.