Simeons Protocol -- P3/P4 Week of 7/4/11

[chicamala]

My first post in P3. I'm up and out of leeway. I am premenstrual, but I also had cheese and am thinking cheese is a no go for me since it has so much sodium. I am doing a correction day as recommended even though I usually have a pretty sizeable gain from water weight around my cycle. I feel better doing it, though. I'm doing an egg day, cause that is what I have.

[catkin]

Originally Posted by porkfatrules

You're a bad, bad person.

Not for eating those, but for gloating!

Not a gloat! A victory!

[CarrieZohn]

Currently one week into P3 and shockingly enough, no need for any CDs. I've maintained well and I have felt so full!! Went out to eat and I did slide a bit outside my 2lb window but one day of clean eating and I was back within my happy home. I'm so shocked that this all works so well!! I'm going to do P3 for two more weeks and cycle back into R2 around mid-July (just in time to load with my oldest daughter's birthday cake LOL). Lost 26lbs in 37 days with R1. I know that I shouldn't expect the same or more but rather, should expect less weight loss on R2 but even 15 - 20lbs on R2 would make me happy (and put me in one-derland which I haven't seen in probably 12 years, prior to the birth of my first daughter who will be 11 on July 15). I'm really excited and so happy to have found this place. The majority of that Yahoo group has been so rude to me. Ugh. I like the "huggy huggy kissy kissy" atmosphere here.

[chicamala]

Originally Posted by CarrieZohn

Currently one week into P3 and shockingly enough, no need for any CDs. I've maintained well and I have felt so full!! Went out to eat and I did slide a bit outside my 2lb window but one day of clean eating and I was back within my happy home. I'm so shocked that this all works so well!! I'm going to do P3 for two more weeks and cycle back into R2 around mid-July (just in time to load with my oldest daughter's birthday cake LOL). Lost 26lbs in 37 days with R1. I know that I shouldn't expect the same or more but rather, should expect less weight loss on R2 but even 15 - 20lbs on R2 would make me happy (and put me in one-derland which I haven't seen in probably 12 years, prior to the birth of my first daughter who will be 11 on July 15). I'm really excited and so happy to have found this place. The majority of that Yahoo group has been so rude to me. Ugh. I like the "huggy huggy kissy kissy" atmosphere here.

That's really super!!

[LaraSuzz]

Morning all! i will be in p3 on Thursay and I can't wait! My only regret is that I look my injection late so Iwill have to wait until 830am to eat breakfast, lol.

Oh boy, do I have some plans for p3!! I will go shopping today, and then tomorrow I will make my creamed spinach and tomato sauce with italian sausage. I miss food. I don't even want to eat my lunch. I wish that I had some skimmed milk cottage cheese! Less than 48 hours to go!

[porkfatrules]

Originally Posted by catkin

Not a gloat! A victory!

Pah -- You say tomato, I say to-mah-to . . .

I still say you're a horrible person for taunting us P3ers.

[porkfatrules]

Originally Posted by RedL.I.

PFR: Hey - I think I read you were going to do another round in August, is that right? I'm planning on loading somewhere around August 6 and 7 - we'd have fun. We can do rants!!

Yup, yup! I'm on vacation until the end of July, but then have a few weeks at home, along with the hubby, while the monsters -- I mean boys -- are at camp. So, I'm waffling about when to start R2 (wait, did I just say "waffle?" mmm, waffles . . . ) -- part of me wants to get going and lose more weight ASAP, and the other part wants to have fun and go out with my husband (instead of being the no-I-only-want-to-eat-3.5-ounces-of-chicken-dear Pilgrim). So, my exact start date TBD. I will jealously be reading about your losses if you start before me.

[LaraSuzz]

I started p4 with new nuts lol pistacios and peanuts cashews etc.. and then I started with low carb tortillas and Ezequiel bread (low carb whole grain.. find it at Trader Joes of Sunflower market)then I moved on to Dreamfields pasta which I love, and garbanzo beans, peas, but tried to stay clear of refined sugar and flour. I experimented with almond flour and miracle noodles which are both equally disgusting, lol. I try to think of real foods that I would eat normally that are low carb to start out with and tweek them. Just take it slow and you will know which foods cause a gain just like in P3.

[KelliC]

This may be a dumb question:blush: but what is the difference between agave syrup and real maple syrup? I mean, obviously they are different but as far as health reasons go? I've still been having sugar free syrup with my french toast and pancakes and would like to try something else

[Angel In TN]

Thank you, Kelli!!!

[dazygyrl]

a lot, actually. they aren't anything the same.

agave is just a sweet syrup. i don't think it has any taste.

maple syrup is...well...maple-y. lol!

agave is touted to be low glyemic so slow impact on blood sugar. maple syrup, not so much....very sugary.

[RedsSkinnyJeans]

Originally Posted by porkfatrules

and the other part wants to have fun and go out with my husband .

I hear ya!! If you two decide you want to take the New London boat down to my neck of the woods for a fun vacation day, I'd love to meet ya'll for a ....umm...club soda or something!

Originally Posted by LaraSuzz

I started p4 with new nuts lol pistacios and peanuts cashews etc.. and then I started with low carb tortillas and Ezequiel bread (low carb whole grain.. find it at Trader Joes of Sunflower market)then I moved on to Dreamfields pasta which I love, and garbanzo beans, peas, but tried to stay clear of refined sugar and flour. I experimented with almond flour and miracle noodles which are both equally disgusting, lol. I try to think of real foods that I would eat normally that are low carb to start out with and tweek them. Just take it slow and you will know which foods cause a gain just like in P3.

Okay - I should just stop talking. LOL I realize that I HAVE tried most of that stuff. So maybe I'm doing it ok. Love me some nuts! Love the almond flour, and have tried some low carb tortillas. Beans, peas, potatoes, etc all are on the list. I think when I feel better I'll be more industrious.

Lara, you are SO sweet to look up that info for me. Thank you!! I hope to be able to support you as well. :-)

Originally Posted by KelliC

This may be a dumb question:blush: but what is the difference between agave syrup and real maple syrup? I mean, obviously they are different but as far as health reasons go? I've still been having sugar free syrup with my french toast and pancakes and would like to try something else

Here is an example of a dumb question: "Can I please knit some booties for my pet snake?" or... "Why won't Trace Adkins answer my emails personally?"

Kelli, from what i hear, (and again, this is subject to further research), the affect of agave nectar on our glycemic index is not as low as stevia certainly, but it MUCH lower than sugar or honey, and I LOVE the taste!!! There are also flavored syrups, like vanilla. Agave Nectar Vs. Stevia | LIVESTRONG.COM


(I had to take a pain pill tonight, so I'm like the drunk Irish girl at the bar saying "Man I love all you guys") LOL

[RedsSkinnyJeans]

More agave syrup info here:

FAQ | www.TheIOAA.com - The International Organic Agave Alliance

Also:
2.6 What is the Glycemic Index of agave syrup?
The GI, measuring the impact of foods on blood sugars, indicates the level of glucose in a food.

Agave syrup Glycemic Index (GI) standard is 32. Honey is at 58, cane table sugar at 64. For diabetics, using the Glycemic load guide that includes a factor for the amount of food consumed, agave syrup load level is low, 7.36 per tablespoon, 2.45 per teaspoon.

[KelliC]

Dazy and Red--Thanks I think I'll try that first then-- I think I hear publix calling me now

Originally Posted by RedL.I.

Here is an example of a dumb question: "Can I please knit some booties for my pet snake?" or... "Why won't Trace Adkins answer my emails personally?"

BWAHAHAHAH!

Originally Posted by RedL.I.

(I had to take a pain pill tonight, so I'm like the drunk Irish girl at the bar saying "Man I love all you guys") LOL

lol, I need one of those, my atlas orthogonal doc. is out of town and 2 percocet later I still have a migraine Hoping to sleep a bit of it off, have a great night

[catkin]

Originally Posted by CarrieZohn

Currently one week into P3 and shockingly enough, no need for any CDs. I've maintained well and I have felt so full!! Went out to eat and I did slide a bit outside my 2lb window but one day of clean eating and I was back within my happy home. I'm so shocked that this all works so well!! I'm going to do P3 for two more weeks and cycle back into R2 around mid-July (just in time to load with my oldest daughter's birthday cake LOL). Lost 26lbs in 37 days with R1. I know that I shouldn't expect the same or more but rather, should expect less weight loss on R2 but even 15 - 20lbs on R2 would make me happy (and put me in one-derland which I haven't seen in probably 12 years, prior to the birth of my first daughter who will be 11 on July 15). I'm really excited and so happy to have found this place. The majority of that Yahoo group has been so rude to me. Ugh. I like the "huggy huggy kissy kissy" atmosphere here.

[catkin]

Originally Posted by porkfatrules

Oh no, you didn't!

You didn't just say the words, "toast with butter," did you?

You didn't just say, "chocolate chip cookies," did you?

No, that would be too evil. I'm sure I just imagined it.

Originally Posted by porkfatrules

You're a bad, bad person.

Not for eating those, but for gloating!

Originally Posted by porkfatrules

Pah -- You say tomato, I say to-mah-to . . .

I still say you're a horrible person for taunting us P3ers.

Is this supposed to be funny?

[RedsSkinnyJeans]

Originally Posted by catkin

Is this supposed to be funny?

I'd be willing to bet a whole lot that it is. I "heard" it in the sisterly way that siblings tease each other. In my family, teasing is a sign of affection. I took it as good-natured ribbing.

Good morning folks!

I woke up at my set point - so I suppose that's good. I have next to me the South Beach diet book. Have a goal to look through that today as well as read up on the maintenance phase of Atkins.

I am having a real struggle with the "sick" identity thing. My friends text me, and I'm like" "I'm getting there" - so then I get an invite someplace, and then I have to tell them I have a fever, etc. I could not move off the recliner yesterday except for what was vital. Horrible wave of recurring Lyme stuff and so painful. And outside, beautiful beach days roll by. I keep telling myself to think "Big Picture" - (which I think is always the course of wisdom). I have something that will pass.

I think I'll try to get out for a meal in the sunshine today............ Perhaps I'll invite Dominique Strauss-Kahn and Casey Anthony out for a nice steak........yeah, that's the ticket.............. I know a guy who knows a guy...........Vito, and his brother Vinny the knife; they own a butcher shop near the Jersey shore. Sometimes they hang out at the landfill late at night.

Sorry. Just kidding. :-)

[1moretry]

Originally Posted by RedL.I.

Good morning everybody :-)
I had to keep checking the title of the thread - thought I was in the wrong one with the P2 talk. (so sleepy!)

Didn't even weigh yet.
Think I'm back down. I ate less yesterday - and smart. HB eggs, salad with blue cheese, steak and salad. I think I'm back down to "normal"

I have realized that I'm P4-tarded.
Being culinarily challenged, (yes, I made that a word), I think I got in a rut with P3.
I'm still very shy of carbs and sugar. And that's good, I suppose, I never had to do a correction day. But, at the same time, I'm supposed to be incorporating in some sugar and carbs now. I have fallen head over heels in love with agave syrup - so I use that, but don't experiment around a lot. Gotta fix that. I mean, I can HAVE corn, a baked potato, a full glass of milk. And I, (like so many other things on this diet), just feel so SURE I will gain from it!!! I need to read more. To me, if I have a WHOLE lotta butter with my eggs, and then I make some breakfast potatoes with those eggs and bacon - it's all goin' back on the butt!!! Clearly there is an art to P4 that I need to learn.

My subconscious is so convinced that carbs and sugars, (even the naturally occurring ones, of which I have small amounts), are from the devil!

Off to get more coffee - glad to have you all here!!

I think it depends on what is important to you. If keeping your fat off is the goal, then it's quite likely that HIGH carbs and ALLL sugar will work against that. Taubes makes it quite clear that what's safe is HIGH FAT and too many carbs will increase insulin resistance, result in fat storage and lead to diabetes and the many features of metabolic syndrome. For those of us (I am included in this) who are genetically predisposed to gain weight/fat, carbs beyond a certain amount ARE "from the devil."

I don't remember reading anywhere that one "should" add carbs and sugar back in P4. I haven't re-read P&I, but it seems to me that he said that we could experiment with adding back carbs in P4 and watch the results on the scale every day. According to what I understand, P3 is for stabilizing and creating your new set point and P4 is for finding out how you will be able to eat for the rest of your life without gaining weight. One person with a great deal of experience with this WOE said that SHE found that high carbs OR high fat were okay for her, but the combination of high carbs AND high fat were deadly.

Age has something to do with this, too. For those of us who develop insulin resistance (my husband and his whole family don't), this tendency increases with age, so what one could get away with in their 20s is definitely not going to work that way in their 40s or beyond.

Don't beat yourself up if you are afraid of carbs and sugar. There might be a very good reason for that concern. I don't recommend living in fear at any time. However, I do feel that carbs (and sugar in particular) are dangerous territory. Taubes also points out that they set us up to crave the things that make us fat. We are each very individual in our response to anything we put in our mouths, so we have to find out what works or doesn't work for each of us. What works for one might not work for another, and it takes courage to be true to ourselves, no matter what anyone else does.

Taubes also says that, based on his description of how carbs and sugar affect our bodies, some sacrifice is involved if we want to lose the fat and keep it off. If you are living comfortably without those foods that were problematic for you, enjoy that! That's good, not bad, as long as you are getting the nutrition you need in one way or another.

[porkfatrules]

Originally Posted by catkin

Is this supposed to be funny?

Yes yes definitely! Sorry, just being silly/dramatic about having to read the words "chocolate chips" when one is still in P3 -- I thought that by now, EVERYBODY knows that I'm almost always being silly.

(Clearly I need to use more smiley emoticons . . .)

Red -- I'm so sorry you're feeling bad again! It really stinks, just as we've finally gotten some decent weather. Hang in there, try to enjoy the sunshine even if you don't feel great (it's gotta be better than indoor on the sofa, right?) and stick with it -- the Lyme will recede eventually.

[1moretry]

Originally Posted by CarrieZohn

Currently one week into P3 and shockingly enough, no need for any CDs. I've maintained well and I have felt so full!! Went out to eat and I did slide a bit outside my 2lb window but one day of clean eating and I was back within my happy home. I'm so shocked that this all works so well!! I'm going to do P3 for two more weeks and cycle back into R2 around mid-July (just in time to load with my oldest daughter's birthday cake LOL). Lost 26lbs in 37 days with R1. I know that I shouldn't expect the same or more but rather, should expect less weight loss on R2 but even 15 - 20lbs on R2 would make me happy (and put me in one-derland which I haven't seen in probably 12 years, prior to the birth of my first daughter who will be 11 on July 15). I'm really excited and so happy to have found this place. The majority of that Yahoo group has been so rude to me. Ugh. I like the "huggy huggy kissy kissy" atmosphere here.

Carrie, I looked at your WOE and it says you are doing injections (which is what I am working with, also). Doesn't that require 6 weeks' break between rounds, not 3?

I have just started P3 this week and expect to begin my second round on Aug. 13. My main concern is that I don't want to become resistant to the HCG (which is why Simeons said we have to wait 6 weeks between rounds 1 and 2 and add 2 weeks more for each successive round) or mess up my metabolism more than I have already. I think our bodies need to rest and adapt to our new set point, but that's just my thinking. I am still a relative newbie with all of this, although I do think I know how to do P2 correctly now.

Glad to have you here.

[1moretry]

Originally Posted by KelliC

This may be a dumb question:blush: but what is the difference between agave syrup and real maple syrup? I mean, obviously they are different but as far as health reasons go? I've still been having sugar free syrup with my french toast and pancakes and would like to try something else

Not a dumb question. They are both concentrated forms of sugar and, depending on how sensitive you are to sugar (how your body responds to it), they might not be very different. However, agave syrup has a lower glycemic index than maple syrup, so for some people, for awhile, it might be a better choice. I used to tolerate agave syrup, but after seeing what it did to me on load, I have decided to go with something else called yacon syrup if I need a sweetener. It is more of a probiotic, but not as sweet, and apparently doesn't get absorbed by the body as sugar.

After coming off P2, I taste natural sweetness much more, and just using coconut oil is about as sweet as I want. I can taste the natural sugars in veggies, too, just as they are. I have not missed sweets, but wasn't big on them later in life, except for chocolate.

I went with agave-sweetened chocolate items toward the end, but now my husband is planning on making me some chocolate pudding made with lactose-free milk, yacon syrup and glucomannon powder (same stuff that makes up Miracle Noodles and has zero carbs) instead of agave and cornstarch when I get through with my rounds.

[1moretry]

Checking in with absolutely no change in my weight for the third day in a row. Looks like my body has settled on a new set point (1.2 lbs above LIW), but it may be too early to decide.

Blood sugar up a tad again, and not sure what (if anything) to do about that. The fluctuations drive me crazy because they don't seem to relate to anything I do or don't do in a direct way. It is still 15-20 points lower than it was before P2, and my husband (my best cheerleader sometimes) says he thinks it will come down some more when I do my next round of P2 and lose some more weight. I hope he's right. Am still using ****** and trying to keep my proteins at 25% or less. Fat is my friend right now and I just added back sour cream and love it just as it is.

I wish I could just talk to my body and have it tell me (in very specific terms) what to eat and what not to eat. All of this trial and error is exhausting!

[shelbyla]

Morning all. I'm BAAAAACK! I missed you guys! I will try and catch up on posts later but hope everyone is well.

As for me, I came back from vacation 1 pound above my window and 5 pounds up from when I left. Gack. And I didn't even go too crazy! Well, except for the last day when I basically ate everything that was bad for me that I could lay my hands on! :blush: Who invented fair food anyway?

Anyway, GY CD for me today. Let's see if I can stick to it. By the end of the day I am just BORED with it!

[moonriver]

Weight holding steady. Whew. Must leave today for another road trip for work. Gonna be good instead of eating for entertainment.

[LilacBruze]

Originally Posted by RedL.I.

I am having a real struggle with the "sick" identity thing. My friends text me, and I'm like" "I'm getting there" - so then I get an invite someplace, and then I have to tell them I have a fever, etc. I could not move off the recliner yesterday except for what was vital. Horrible wave of recurring Lyme stuff and so painful. And outside, beautiful beach days roll by. I keep telling myself to think "Big Picture" - (which I think is always the course of wisdom). I have something that will pass.

P2 lurker here.

Red, I feel ya. I have MS and know all too well about being here in that recliner with you. I watch summer - my favorite season - pass me by a lot because heat and MS don't get along and the exacerbations are killer. My MS fatigue has been at a minimum lately but even after 4 years since my diagnosis, friends and family still don't get it. Because I look perfectly fine, they don't understand why I can't enjoy outside activities, or marathon rounds of shopping, or well, pretty much anything.

[LilacBruze]

Originally Posted by RedL.I.

Being culinarily challenged, (yes, I made that a word), I think I got in a rut with P3.

Actually Red, I have been using that phrase for years, to describe my husband. He is not adventurous AT ALL when it comes to food, preferring bland meat and potatoes. He has a saying that even ketchup is too spicy!

[dazygyrl]

weight today well within window. just 0.6 above LDW. going to eat lighter today. the last few days i have eaten legal, yet high calorie foods that were festering in my mind. lol! so now that i have enjoyed them, gonna focus on more balanced calories.

i had the BEST salad last night. spring mix, a can of chicken (the kind that looks like a tuna can), pecan pieces, shredded cheese topped with my homemade strawberry vinaigrette. yummmmm! think i will have that for lunch today, too.

[Angel In TN]

Fourth day of exactly 172

[jabbok]

I am back to ldw this is day 6 for me on P3, I have been sick the last 2 days so I really don't know if I am stabilizing or just not eating enough.

[catkin]

Originally Posted by porkfatrules

Yes yes definitely! Sorry, just being silly/dramatic about having to read the words "chocolate chips" when one is still in P3 -- I thought that by now, EVERYBODY knows that I'm almost always being silly.

(Clearly I need to use more smiley emoticons . . .)

Red -- I'm so sorry you're feeling bad again! It really stinks, just as we've finally gotten some decent weather. Hang in there, try to enjoy the sunshine even if you don't feel great (it's gotta be better than indoor on the sofa, right?) and stick with it -- the Lyme will recede eventually.