The HCGers exercise thread

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

I think I literally buried a lot of that stuff under layers of fat, and it is frightening to get close to them again. It is as if there is trauma stored IN my body, and I am digging close to where it is buried. I think there is a lot of truth to that.

I've done a ton of talk-based emotional work on my abuse trauma, but not a lot of somatic-based work, and I think perhaps that is part of where I need to focus.

Are you familiar with a technique called EMDR?

I fully believe trauma is literally stored in the body!

And it is ironic in a way that my gaining weight is triggering my traumas, while at the same time your losing weight is uncovering yours!

I have always had this idea that my saddlebags represent some hidden trauma- yet to be uncovered..

I think talk-based work can get you so far- but not neccessarily as deep as you need to go. There have got to be other avenues I believe.

I am going to look up EMDR again, I dont remember it well enough.

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

Wow -- thanks for that explanation -- it helps a great deal. I still feel terribly uncomfortable even thinking about doing this, which means there is likely a lot of power in it.

I learned about EMDR before I had ever heard of EFT -- I had a psychology mentor who used it with trauma patients with great success. I do know that it works amazingly well, though not always in the way one imagines it would. The techniques sound like they work somewhat similarly, and accomplish similar outcomes.

I think I am going to do a bit more reading about how, exactly, to do the tapping, and then I will try it out -- cautiously. EMDR isn't really supposed to be done to oneself, and there are good reasons for that ... I managed to put myself into a complete trauma flashback that way once! It ended up clearing a lot for me, but it could have gone very wrong... so I respect the dangers inherent in using it on oneself. EFT sounds like a safer process on the whole to do on ones own.

Resisting feeling the feelings is most of where we get stuck, I think... the feelings are awful, and so the psyche protects us by banishing the feelings and thoughts to remote corners of the self, and they become difficult (or impossible) to retrieve consciously. Techniques like EMDR/EFT, as well as psychoanalysis, can help us allow those feelings and memories to emerge... and experiencing them is what does the clearing.

I'm not telling you anything you don't already know... as you said in an earlier post, I am talking mainly to myself, here I need reminding that there is progress to be made in going through the resistance to the source of pain.

So much of the way we store trauma is in the body -- it literally, neurologically becomes encoded. It makes sense that healing those traumatic wounds to the body and mind would also aid in healing the bodily systems.

Answer the other posts only if/when you have the time... it is helpful to me to write this down and know it is falling on receptive, supportive ears (well, eyes.)

Hi Mini

I like to answer the posts, it is all helpful and relevant to me too.

I like to think that healing the inner wounds can spontaneously heal some of the outer physical issues, or at least clear the path in order to get any needed healing from an external source.

I like the way you put it about resisting the feelings,
and the psyche banishing them to a remote part where we cant feel them, and that accessing and feeling them enables the clearing.
It is what I have experienced.
And some of those things are so deep, and super hard to access,
or sometimes we literally split ourselves off from parts of ourselves so we dont have to feel things stored there.

I have opened up some dark stuff via EFT, or by going into a meditative state; quite scary and very dark, some sexual abuse stuff, stuff around childhood punishment etc..
but I have always managed to come through it/out of it- by following and trusting the process.
At times though it feels fully overwhelming , usually when you are smack in the middle of
re-experiencing deep trauma and the emotions involved.
I have always done it on my own to date.

From memory EFT has similar elements to EMDR, though at the time of looking at them both I remember thinking that EFT was more potent, and made things more accessible.
There is a knack to working with it though- in my mind it is not just a mechanical process, but a tool to accelerate inner opening and clearing.
And it does bring a lot of conscious insights, in my experience.

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

The natural, organic shifts you describe are very much what I have experienced when undergoing EMDR... they are rather indescribable, but very profound. Unlike talking through something, and having insights, these shifts seem to happen at light speed, and within the nervous system. Strange stuff -- and a bit scary in that it requires a lot of trust in the process....

EMDR sounds really good the way you describe it. It motivates me to go back and have another look at it.

I am sure if you can get EMDR to work in that way that you will be able to work with EFT powerfully too!

And it is simple really- you can do very simple versions of it, and
you can do it to yourself..

[nola baxter]

Well, I went to the gym yesterday- 7 days since last time.

Overall , I was strong;
either maintaining the status quo , or improving in some exercises.

I took my lunges up to 85kg, breaking new territory- so I have to mentally celebrate that!.

And I managed to do 3 reps on 60 kg with close grip bench press;
whereas I have only gone to 55kg with the close grip bench press before -
also new territory..
Soon I will be better at the close grip bench press than the normal wide grip version?!

I also notice quite obviously these days that my quads have grown over the past months- they are big!

[minimonkey]

Nola

Excellent about your impressive new weights at the gym!!! That bench press sounds brutal -- you must be developing some major chest muscle!

I'm not surprised your quads are big -- they were pretty big before, and that is some heavy lunging you are doing !!! That's fantastic!

[minimonkey]

I tried the EFT -- I think it may take me a while to get the technique down, as I found I was in my head a lot while doing it...but towards the end I felt something like an electric vibration running through my upper body.

I've also been doing short EMDR sessions on myself -- I did them the last two nights, and again this afternoon.

Today, I had an abuse memory surface ( I also have sexual abuse in my history) -- it was very vivid, and a deeply somatic experiencing of it, and I moved through it very quickly. It was interesting that it came up, since I was concentrating on my fear around eating and the need for bodily control -- obviously there is a connection there.

This time, I knew not to stop the process in mid-memory, but just to let it flow, and it was all over within a few seconds, if that.

I am going to keep doing these little sessions on myself and see what comes of it -- I'd never advocate self-EMDR for anyone else, but I know a lot of people who do it with good results -- and I am willing to take the risks involved.

I will also keep experimenting with EFT, and see if the process becomes more natural in time.

[minimonkey]

On the dietary front, I think I am going to aim for maintenance until my new drops arrive -- and I am not sure when that will be, since they are currently back ordered, but it seems likely to be a couple of weeks at least (from what I read on another board). So, I think I will stop dosing with the hhcg as of today, weigh tomorrow, and aim to maintain on p3 for a bit. If I lose some, wonderful -- but if I start to gain, I'll do correction days, etc., and stay on top of the problem.

I just don't have it in me to struggle right now and engage in a fight that is getting me nowhere -- and maintenance has been the best I've been achieving for a while, at any rate. This way, I won't be likely to be as burnt out on dieting when my drops do arrive -- at which point I am committed to doing a real round of p2, and will at least be attempting protocol.

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

I tried the EFT -- I think it may take me a while to get the technique down, as I found I was in my head a lot while doing it...but towards the end I felt something like an electric vibration running through my upper body.

I've also been doing short EMDR sessions on myself -- I did them the last two nights, and again this afternoon.

Today, I had an abuse memory surface ( I also have sexual abuse in my history) -- it was very vivid, and a deeply somatic experiencing of it, and I moved through it very quickly. It was interesting that it came up, since I was concentrating on my fear around eating and the need for bodily control -- obviously there is a connection there.

This time, I knew not to stop the process in mid-memory, but just to let it flow, and it was all over within a few seconds, if that.

I am going to keep doing these little sessions on myself and see what comes of it -- I'd never advocate self-EMDR for anyone else, but I know a lot of people who do it with good results -- and I am willing to take the risks involved.

I will also keep experimenting with EFT, and see if the process becomes more natural in time.

I wouldnt worry too much about the exact technique of EFT, though it is good to know it;
so many people end up bastardizing the technique in a way that suits them, and get results.
It sounds like you got something right anyway!
The first few times I tried EFT nothing was happening for me on any front- but I kept going and started to feel changes.
It wasnt long before I got into a real groove.

It sounds like you are doing so well already, with bringing up a memory and processing it really quickly.
Sexual abuse is a hard one too, as it involves the body so much at a deep level,
and in my experience it causes us turn us against our bodies and see them as something really wrong and errant, and as an enemy - needing to be controlled and contained and made to do the right thing! -
and thats why there is the strong connnection with food, diet, control etc..
It hasnt come up for me yet this time round- but it has in the past, always unexpectedly and spontaneously, so I wonder if it is going to pop up again.

I had a blue day in the end yesterday, and am feeling it this morning too.
I am struggling around letting go of the reins, and potential gain.
I was really hungry yesterday (a consequence of the big workout the day before no doubt), and ate well,
and this brought up feelings of fear again about out of control gaining and the possible consequences of letting go of control etc.
So there is still a lot more there to be dealt with obviously!
It was depressing to go into a strongly negative state after feeling the positive clearance from the days previous.
And that daunting feeling- how much more is there to go?! Will I ever get to the bottom of this?

I just thought of phrases to tap on,
"Even though I feel that if I let go I will go out of control, I deeply and completely love and accept myself"
"Even though I feel that if I let go I will gain weight , I deeply and completely love and accept myself"
"Even though I still fear that gaining of weight, I deeply and completely love and accept myself"
"Even though I dont actually want to gain weight, I deeply and completely love and accept myself"

I had this feeling/thought/intuition last night that I should stop from resisting eating food , in a natural uninhibited fashion,
that the continual resisting of the desire to eat was not actually the right thing to be doing.
So there was a small mental shift or understanding there,
but as to the results of it- that is the bit I am worried about.
But there is still fear there for me involved in this- big fear,
and that is what I need to unearth.
I have controlled food and eating for almost all of my adult life- I actual dont really know too much else! Its a total instinct- lol..

I got brave and tried on a skirt this morning that I was not even sure if I would still fit- it was tight- showing the weight gain over the past few weeks..
But at least I know where I am at, something I have been afraid to know.

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

On the dietary front, I think I am going to aim for maintenance until my new drops arrive -- and I am not sure when that will be, since they are currently back ordered, but it seems likely to be a couple of weeks at least (from what I read on another board). So, I think I will stop dosing with the hhcg as of today, weigh tomorrow, and aim to maintain on p3 for a bit. If I lose some, wonderful -- but if I start to gain, I'll do correction days, etc., and stay on top of the problem.

I just don't have it in me to struggle right now and engage in a fight that is getting me nowhere -- and maintenance has been the best I've been achieving for a while, at any rate. This way, I won't be likely to be as burnt out on dieting when my drops do arrive -- at which point I am committed to doing a real round of p2, and will at least be attempting protocol.

Hi Mini

I have for some reason reached a point where I have very little- if anything, left in me to fight and struggle against the weight issue.
Almost like being forced/cornered into a place where I have had to let go and let the fears and issues around it surface.

What kind of calories do you estimate for your maintenance? Are you going to try to control it to a certain level or number?
Or are you just going to go with the flow and see how it goes?

[minimonkey]

Nola -- I also faced myself this morning ...on the scale -- it's up a tad to 107.8, which isn't terrible, but it doesn't thrill me, either. I am still holding a lot of water -- I can tell that from the dents in my legs from bed linens, clothing, etc. in the mornings. The number was about what I expected.

It actually feels better to know the truth than to be living in fear of it, even if it is discouraging a bit.

I'm hoping to eat according to hunger, and not let the calories dictate my eating during maintenance, but that will be a try-it-and-see sort of plan. I'm adhering to the p3 rule of no starch, no sugar -- so the focus will be protein, good fat, veggies and a small amount of low glycemic fruit.

This morning I was less hungry than usual -- I ate a good breakfast (more like lunch, since I overslept a great deal!) - and that may be it for the day unless I get hungry later. I am hoping my body will guide me on this one -- but we'll see.

You hit it right on the head about the effects of sexual abuse -- it shatters the self on so many levels!

Your tapping phrases sound right on target -- and I am sorry that you are still feeling so despondent ... I think this sort of process is rarely linear, but it comes and goes in waves.... sending hugs and support to you!

[shelbyla]

Ok sorry to intrude but I am coming out of lurkdom with a question for you two. First off, let me say that I have been reading about your emotional unearthings with interest, particularly around the techniques. I've had therapy previously for a number of years but never really got what was needed out of it (or I didn't feel like it helped at all--maybe it did?). It's very brave of you both to go to these extents so uncover what must be some really profoundly painful stuff. I admire you both deeply for the work that you are doing and wish you all the success in the world getting what you need from it.

So my question is this: I haven't struggled with a lot of body hatred or fear of gaining weight (that I know of, anyway). Even at my heaviest, I have what some might say is reverse body dysmorphia--I look at myself in the mirror and think "Wow, my abs look great." Or "I love my chest at this weight." It's only in pictures that I can see the truth. I HAVE struggled with regaining weight numerous times and wonder if I have some sort of block against allowing myself to be at a healthy weight. I don't have issues with attention from men/people. I don't have issues with worrying that people won't respect me if I am attractive. What I struggle with most is guilt. Guilt of eating. Guilt of enjoying eating. Guilt of eating more than I should or eating things that I know I "shouldn't". I know why I "shouldn't" eat them. They make me feel bad (wheat), they make me gain weight (sugar), they set off horrendous cravings (sugar/wheat), they make my lipid profile horrible (processed foods--usually involving sugar/carbs). But none of this is really related to the weight, per se. Or is it??? Any thoughts? Any ideas on how to figure this out? Sorry to dump this on you but you seem to at least have some techniques or ideas on how to go about it...

[ThinLisy]

Hi all,
I'm looking for some guidelines on what should I do. I'm ending my first round (40+2 days) Feb 13 and I'm planning to start working out for real (like insanity) to get in shape for sure. I have never being athletic nor like to really exercise even though I have muscle in me (thank God for that), but do recognize that when I do I feel much better, have much better and feel less lazy.

Now that I am not as heavy as before and have more energy I do feel as I can start doing some sort of exercise, but don't know what to do during p2, I don't what to create a starvation mode, but I don't what to start p3 from 0, so what do you wise people recommend?

Thank you any input will be greatly appreciated!

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by ThinLisy

Hi all,
I'm looking for some guidelines on what should I do. I'm ending my first round (40+2 days) Feb 13 and I'm planning to start working out for real (like insanity) to get in shape for sure. I have never being athletic nor like to really exercise even though I have muscle in me (thank God for that), but do recognize that when I do I feel much better, have much better and feel less lazy.

Now that I am not as heavy as before and have more energy I do feel as I can start doing some sort of exercise, but don't know what to do during p2, I don't what to create a starvation mode, but I don't what to start p3 from 0, so what do you wise people recommend?

Thank you any input will be greatly appreciated!

Hmm, well I would be careful about any kind of intense exercise on P2.
I dont know if many people can actually do it without suffering ill effects.
ie, getting too hungry or drained.
Light walking or other light forms of exercise should be okay?

And just keep monitoring your body as you go;
ie, if you are getting too tired or hungry back off the exercise-
or up calories by a couple of hundred to compensate.

Others might have more specific exercise recommendations?

[minimonkey]

Hmm ... Shelby -- the first thing I would do is try to really understand what is underlying the guilt -- when you start feeling it, pay attention to what it is about -- why is enjoying eating worthy of guilt? Where did that message come from? What does it mean about you if you are a person who enjoys eating? Etc.

As for eating things that make you feel bad... what is the gain in doing it? Why does that gain outweigh the potential discomfort that will be involved in the long run?

That's a good first step for starting to untangle all this stuff...

Thanks for the kind words about undergoing processes like this... it isn't easy, but it is worthwhile. Hugs!

[minimonkey]

I totally second Nola's recommendations about p2 -- in fact, if you aren't used to exercising at the moment, I'd stick to very easy exercise such as brisk walking -- or maybe add in some isometric exercises such as Callanetics, the beginning Bar Method workouts -- something of that sort.

I'd honestly wait for p3 to start anything too challenging, and then I'd ramp up to the Insanity level -- those workouts are killer, and they can result in injuries if you take them on too quickly. Maybe start with a more moderate version of HIIT/interval training first, and then progress to Insanity?

I think one of the main reasons people don't have long term success with working out is that they tend to be impatient, and start out doing advanced workouts way too soon - they end up injured, or just plain demoralized, and they quit.

There's nothing weak or unmotivated about starting out at a moderate or a beginning level, and then progressing as your body adapts...it's actually a much smarter approach and brings much better results.

I don't do well with hard exercise on P2 at all -- I find it works against me all around.

[nola baxter]

Mini has talked about having a new thread, for specifically discussing emotional/psychological issues around body, food, diet etc,
and I think it is a good idea.
Unless anyone else wants to do it,
I will open a thread and call it something?
The inner issues of food/diet and the body?

I was also thinking we could start a new exercise thread -
start afresh on that too..

[minimonkey]

Nola -- excellent suggestions! Just be sure to include hcg in the title somewhere if you want it to stay here in the hcg section, and not get moved to another section of the board altogether...

So....Hcg and inner issues...etc. Hcg and exercise...etc.

[minimonkey]

I'm all for you starting these threads, too Go for it!

[nola baxter]

Hi Shelby

Mini has said some good stuff.

I would use anything that works for you, whether it is writing things down,
EFT ( EFT Learning the Mechanics Short-Cut Version),
or whatever technique or mode helps you to just get a bit deeper than the surface.

Start from where you are at,
ie, feelings of guilt around food
feeling bad about eating too much
feeling bad about eating what you "shouldnt" eat

And start expressing them to yourself verbally, internally, or by writing,
and just start feeling and sensing them,
and allow the fullness of the feelings to come up.
A good time to do this is when you are right in the middle of feelings!

Start to look behind,beyond or beneath the feelings to feel and sense anything that is hidden behind them, ie, hidden beliefs, associative memories, physical feelings in the body, repetitive thoughts, overwhelming emotions.

Often the feelings you are talking of are just the tip of the iceberg showing above the surface, and underneath is a bunch of stuff that is at the root of it.

For me, when I start going below the surface I sometimes find deep painful emotions of shame, guilt, fear, etc.,
usually stemming from specific or non-specific events in the past, often from childhood.
Usually there are core beliefs hidden under there,
which can be something like,'
"I am a bad person"
"I am shameful"
"I dont deserve to eat and enjoy myself"
"I dont deserve to eat"
"I am not allowed to have anything nice"
or whatever!!
These kind of beliefs are usually formed during some painful or traumatic experiences,
and then we unwittingly keep on living them out and replaying them in our lives, consciously or unconsciously.

For instance if someone rapes us, we might form quite a lot of negative beliefs;
ie, "all men are bastards"
"I am a bad person that this happened to me"
"sex is bad and painful"
"my body is a hateful thing"
and so on...
As well as having a whole bunch of painful and unsavoury emotions..

Some beliefs and emotions are more deeply anchored into deep and painful experiences that need to be unearthed for full clearance,
and some are lighter and more easily discarded or dealt with..

For me feeling or re-experiencing something fully-
a kind of catharsis experience,
usually helps to clear it.
If it is not cleared, there is usually something more there , or other aspects or tangents, that need to be dealt with.

Trying to explain..lol
I hope you will get some ideas.

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

Nola -- excellent suggestions! Just be sure to include hcg in the title somewhere if you want it to stay here in the hcg section, and not get moved to another section of the board altogether...

So....Hcg and inner issues...etc. Hcg and exercise...etc.

Ok, good- thanks for letting me know!
Off for a walk again - I will do it later.
trying hard to get marbled fat legs.. lol

[lola211]

Hi everyone,

I've read.... a lot of this thread with interest (20 pages or so) and then had to give up, mostly because everyone seems to be waaaay ahead of me.

I'm thinking this... I need to lose about 30lbs. I've been inactive for a few years but I used to be very fit. I tend to do well with weight lifting etc, although I haven't done anything for awhile.

I'm starting HCG, I know all about it, but don't want to wait to start exercising. I'm thinking of just doing Jillian's 30 day shred as I go along.

Is there anyone in a similar position, either now or in the past? Fat loss is my priority, so Im thinking I want to stay on the 500cal as much as possible, perhaps upping protein as I feel I need to. Any suggestions?

There's so much info on these pages. Most of it seems to be people who have achieved goal and are experimenting, whereas I'm just starting.

Do any of you think this is a bad idea?

I need to change my life around, an I feel that just doing the diet and nothing else will probably not work for me. I need change.

This is vague, I know, but any tips or advice for a novice would be appreciated.

[Izzysdream]

Originally Posted by nola baxter

Hi Shelby

Mini has said some good stuff.

I would use anything that works for you, whether it is writing things down,
EFT ( EFT Learning the Mechanics Short-Cut Version),
or whatever technique or mode helps you to just get a bit deeper than the surface.

Start from where you are at,
ie, feelings of guilt around food
feeling bad about eating too much
feeling bad about eating what you "shouldnt" eat

And start expressing them to yourself verbally, internally, or by writing,
and just start feeling and sensing them,
and allow the fullness of the feelings to come up.
A good time to do this is when you are right in the middle of feelings!

Start to look behind,beyond or beneath the feelings to feel and sense anything that is hidden behind them, ie, hidden beliefs, associative memories, physical feelings in the body, repetitive thoughts, overwhelming emotions.

Often the feelings you are talking of are just the tip of the iceberg showing above the surface, and underneath is a bunch of stuff that is at the root of it.

For me, when I start going below the surface I sometimes find deep painful emotions of shame, guilt, fear, etc.,
usually stemming from specific or non-specific events in the past, often from childhood.
Usually there are core beliefs hidden under there,
which can be something like,'
"I am a bad person"
"I am shameful"
"I dont deserve to eat and enjoy myself"
"I dont deserve to eat"
"I am not allowed to have anything nice"
or whatever!!
These kind of beliefs are usually formed during some painful or traumatic experiences,
and then we unwittingly keep on living them out and replaying them in our lives, consciously or unconsciously.

For instance if someone rapes us, we might form quite a lot of negative beliefs;
ie, "all men are bastards"
"I am a bad person that this happened to me"
"sex is bad and painful"
"my body is a hateful thing"
and so on...
As well as having a whole bunch of painful and unsavoury emotions..

Some beliefs and emotions are more deeply anchored into deep and painful experiences that need to be unearthed for full clearance,
and some are lighter and more easily discarded or dealt with..

For me feeling or re-experiencing something fully-
a kind of catharsis experience,
usually helps to clear it.
If it is not cleared, there is usually something more there , or other aspects or tangents, that need to be dealt with.

Trying to explain..lol
I hope you will get some ideas.

Nola, thanks for posting this. I'm definitely going to try it!

[nola baxter]

Originally Posted by Izzysdream

Nola, thanks for posting this. I'm definitely going to try it!

Cool!

There is more discussion about this kind of stuff on the hcg, body issues and diet thread ...

[Izzysdream]

Originally Posted by nola baxter

Ah- what I was going to say in the other post..

The way you EFT something you dont believe is to start by saying it exactly the way it is or how you feel!
ie,
"even though I can never accept and love myself when I am fat, I love and accept myself anyway"
"even though I fully hate myself being fat- I deeply and completely love and accept myself, and my hatred of being fat!"
"even though I cannot accept gaining weight and it is horrible to me, I deeply and completely love and accept myself"
"even though gaining weight is the worst thing that could happen to me,
I deeply love and accept myself"
"even though I can never accept weight gain, I love and accept myself"
"even though I can never accept being fat, I love and accept myself and my non-acceptance of fat"
"I love and accept myself and the fact that I hate gaining weight and being fat!"

and when you have done this for a while you might feel a shift and then might start tapping;

" even though I gain weight- it might be possible I could accept and love myself anyway?"
"even though I am getting fat, I would like to still be able to love myself"
"even though I am getting fat, I want to still be able to love and accept myself anyway"
"even though I am gaining weight, I choose to love and accept myself anyway"
"even though I am gaining weight and it is horrible to me, I love and accept myself"
"even though I am ugly and fat and disgusting, I love and accept myself, and my disgustingness"...lol
and so on..

eventually you might end up tapping
"I can love and accept myself even if I am fat!"
"I can love and accept myself even if I am gaining weight!"
"its okay to love and accept myself, even though I am fat"
"I am allowed to love and accept myself, even when I am gaining weight"

you just start tapping what you feel and change it as it goes along- you will feel shifts
it can be a very natural organic process

Sometimes u can tap opposites like this
I love being fat
I hate being fat
I love myself as a fat person
I hate myself as a fat person.
I cant accept myself when I am gaining weight
I can love and accept myself when I am gaining weight
I cant accept myself as a fat person
I can love and accept myself as a very fat , huge person!

This kind of technique can really throw things up, bring up all kind of feelings, and help with shifts and changes..

Thanks Nola, I've been lurking for a while. This is powerful stuff. I'm going to give it a try.

[nola baxter]

Let us know how u go!
Maybe you will find out something new that we havent..