P3 - Week of 2/14/11

[minimonkey]

Thanks for your vote of confidence, Julie!

I am wondering what kind of results I would have with incorporating a JUDDD type schedule in p3 -- sticking to the protocol of course, but just varying the caloric intake from day to day. Thoughts?

[torister]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

Thanks for your vote of confidence, Julie!

I am wondering what kind of results I would have with incorporating a JUDDD type schedule in p3 -- sticking to the protocol of course, but just varying the caloric intake from day to day. Thoughts?

Wondering what type of results you are looking for in P3? You should not be looking to lose that is for sure.

[minimonkey]

Oh, and I am sticking with the 108.4 as my LDW. That seems to be what my body wants right now -- so be it. I plan to do another round as soon as I can do it safely, so am not too freaked out about a couple of pounds.... they'll come off soon enough.

I am so curious about the reshaping part of p3 -- SO wanting that to happen! That, alone, will keep me from running back to p2 in a panic

[minimonkey]

Torister -- I am not sure what I am looking for, either Reshaping and fitness gains is what I am hoping for.... but I know with my schedule there will be "down days" in terms of food intake -- so wondering if I can vary from day to day and stabilize well.....

[torister]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

Oh, and I am sticking with the 108.4 as my LDW. That seems to be what my body wants right now -- so be it. I plan to do another round as soon as I can do it safely, so am not too freaked out about a couple of pounds.... they'll come off soon enough.

I am so curious about the reshaping part of p3 -- SO wanting that to happen! That, alone, will keep me from running back to p2 in a panic

Well, if you stabilize at 108 (and who wouldn't love that?!?!) then no rational reason to panic and run back to P2. Good luck.

I meant this in a *good* way. Hope it comes across as such!!

[julieboolie]

Mini-I'm not sure it'd be considered JUDD, but if I overdo it (high) and then do a CD (low) I think that's def. calorie cycling ! I don't plan to keep that part of my regular routine, and am already enjoying my bfast today!! I do so enjoy eating!!

I am on day 19 of P3. So far, so good. Friday is technically my first day of P4. Not sure if I will actually experiment at that point, or wait a while longer. Depends on how "stable" I'm feeling. The weekend usually seems to be my biggest challenge. It'd be smarter to wait until weekdays to dabble in starch/sugar in a more controlled environment. We'll see.

Have a happy LC day all!!

[averyjenn]

Oh! I went to the endocrinologist today for bloodwork/checkup for my thyroid. I told her about hcg and she gave me her blessing!

[kj2010]

Originally Posted by minimonkey

I am so curious about the reshaping part of p3 -- SO wanting that to happen! That, alone, will keep me from running back to p2 in a panic

What is this "reshaping" think you speak of?

[torister]

Originally Posted by averyjenn

Oh! I went to the endocrinologist today for bloodwork/checkup for my thyroid. I told her about hcg and she gave me her blessing!

Nice!

[mousie tartufo]

*smacks forehead* Duh, I forgot to subtract the weight of my pjs when I weighed this am. So that puts me RIGHT ON LDW. Yay!

In other news, Callan kicked my abs again today, but I'm starting to see results, so I'm sticking with it. Hubby keeps asking me if I'm "sucking it in" - then I DO "suck it in" and lose 4 more inches! Can't wait until that's the 'norm'!!

Also, FWIW to others looking for it, the reshaping of this plan is also working (in conjunction with my exercise, no doubt), as my bingo wings are slowly shrinking, and last week I noticed that some loose skin that developed on my arms (I could grab the skin, not fat, it was hanging there like an oversized t-shirt) tightened up - can't grab it anymore. So YAY!

[C'Marie]

my steak egg and cheese day only netted me .4 loss - but any loss is a loss and I'll take it. I only did it because of the issues with not enough food to start with and then for some reason felt like I was retaining water and de-stabilizing.

Toristor, I did lay off the almonds - I love them and yes, can overeat them - but previous P3 rounds were no problem with them - except I didn't add them right away for P3 and this time I did because I was trying to get calories up-may be timing issue or I may have developed a problem with them-who knows!? After I stabilize I may try them again. I also have coconut flour to make coconut pancakes and that is such good fiber it helps with other issues. So today's menu:

3 pieces turkey bacon
2 hb eggs
coffee

steak/hamburger 200 grams or more (not sure what's in the fridge at work to cook LOL)
romaine lettuce
little bit of cheese I have left at work
Mustard dressing homemade

boiled eggs or more protein


I think my biggest problems are not enough water and eating too late at night. My days are about 12-14 hours, 10 am to 10 pm + and when I get *home* I destress by going on the computer, drinking some tea, and having a P3 snack - and up until a few nights ago that included peanut butter or almonds- so no nuts and very little cheese for me for a few days at least. Oh, and no visit to the office either for a few days now. That can't be helping. Time for some colon tone.

[Jodarina]

Originally Posted by mousie tartufo

Ladies, please forgive the nervousness of a first timer. I've been so heavy for so long, I'm just fearful of putting it right back on! You can put me in a time out corner if you need to...

I do understand that I need to eat enough to stabilize, and I do know from previous experience what my personal ratios need to be. I am going to push for 1800 today - after being so uncomfortably stuffed yesterday, I'm just going to have to go a bit slower than expected. But my question is that if I'm already moving up (but just within my window), at only 1525, maybe that's closer to enough and I don't need to go up quite as high as the "equation" said I do? It would be so much easier if P3 worked like P2. Too many variables, and I get lost!

You are not the only nervous first timer here! I have the same fears about putting back on this weight I just spent a month trying to release! There are some people I know who think this is a crazy wacky diet and are just waiting for that to happen.

What is the "equation" you mention? I have no idea what my calorie goal should be. Is that what the equation is for? Are the personal ratios protein/fats/carbs % and how does one find out what their person ratio should be?

Seems like most here are just trying to eat mostly protein/fats, hardly any veggies on the menus I see. Should that be a general guideline for P3?

Yesterday was P3D1 and I ate alot of the things I had been craving on P2.
B--Eggs, bacon, cottage cheese, cofee, H&H
S-Clementine
D- 1/2 head of cauliflower, 6 0z broccoli, 7 oz fish
S- pecans .6 oz

I estimated cal at about 1300. Sounds low compared to yours but I felt like was gorging. I was more than a little nervous about my weigh in when I went to bed

This morning my weight was amazingly unchanged from the day before.

[Jodarina]

Originally Posted by julieboolie

Mini-I'm not sure it'd be considered JUDD, but if I overdo it (high) and then do a CD (low) I think that's def. calorie cycling ! I don't plan to keep that part of my regular routine, and am already enjoying my bfast today!! I do so enjoy eating!!

I am on day 19 of P3. So far, so good. Friday is technically my first day of P4. Not sure if I will actually experiment at that point, or wait a while longer. Depends on how "stable" I'm feeling. The weekend usually seems to be my biggest challenge. It'd be smarter to wait until weekdays to dabble in starch/sugar in a more controlled environment. We'll see.

Have a happy LC day all!!

Wow Julie...you are doing awesome!

[torister]

Originally Posted by Jodarina

Seems like most here are just trying to eat mostly protein/fats, hardly any veggies on the menus I see. Should that be a general guideline for P3?

Not true. My menu varies. I have a veggie with lunch and dinner typically and sometimes with bfast. If I am craving a veggie....and I *do* as I really love them...I eat it. Some days not as many. I try to keep things in balance. I am going to add some berries tonight as I am craving them. Just stay flexible and feed your body what it is asking for....and I don't mean chocolate...unless its SF! !

I don't think 1300 calories is nearly enough for you, but hopefully you will up that. Just stick to eat anything and everything except sugar and starch. It couldn't be easier than that. The scale will tell you what foods you are sensitive to or if you are not eating enough...and you adjust.

[amap]

What is a good fat ratio? Right now I am at 60%. Carbs are 13%. Dang apples.

[mousie tartufo]

Originally Posted by Jodarina

You are not the only nervous first timer here! I have the same fears about putting back on this weight I just spent a month trying to release! There are some people I know who think this is a crazy wacky diet and are just waiting for that to happen.

What is the "equation" you mention? I have no idea what my calorie goal should be. Is that what the equation is for? Are the personal ratios protein/fats/carbs % and how does one find out what their person ratio should be?

Seems like most here are just trying to eat mostly protein/fats, hardly any veggies on the menus I see. Should that be a general guideline for P3?

Yesterday was P3D1 and I ate alot of the things I had been craving on P2.
B--Eggs, bacon, cottage cheese, cofee, H&H
S-Clementine
D- 1/2 head of cauliflower, 6 0z broccoli, 7 oz fish
S- pecans .6 oz

I estimated cal at about 1300. Sounds low compared to yours but I felt like was gorging. I was more than a little nervous about my weigh in when I went to bed

This morning my weight was amazingly unchanged from the day before.

Pfft, I'm no expert - like most, I'm finding this a YMMV thing. I'm certainly listening to the long-timers around here, like Peggy and Dawn. They're champs, and seem to be willing to put up with nervous, proof-requiring scientific minds like mine. With little to no complaints. They're either saints, or crazy. maybe both?

I found my personal ratios based on years of paying attention to what i was eating. It turns of that for ME, a diet about 40-50% fat, 40-30% protein and the balance carbs (about 20%) is what works best. But I've ALWAYS done better on fat and protein, even as a kid. Some people are more carby types, and do better with lower fat or protein. There's no set formula, it's entirely up to your personal biochemistry.

The formula I was referring to is the BMR calculation, the Harris-Benedict Equation. It determines your BMR (basal metabolic rate), which is the base amount of calories just to keep you alive. You figure that out, and then multiply the result by a predetermined factor to figure out how many calories you need per day, depending on your activity level.

As to your first day being low, well I discovered that day one I could barely eat - it was an absolute struggle to choke down the 1500+ calories I managed. Yesterday (day 2 P3), was a bit easier, and I managed 1900+. My ability to tolerate more food is increasing, and my appetite is returning; I'm pretty sure I'll be able to hit the 2000+ mark easily today. I think that the body just needs time to adapt. It took a few days for the gut to get used to so little going in; after three weeks, it shouldn't be too surprising if it needs time to get used to having a 'normal' amount of food coming in.

Just my 5 cents worth - inflation, yo!

[kj2010]

Originally Posted by torister

Just stick to eat anything and everything except sugar and starch. It couldn't be easier than that. The scale will tell you what foods you are sensitive to or if you are not eating enough...and you adjust.

So really, eat anything and everything except sugar and starch? Can I eat like 5 pieces of bacon with eggs and cheese if I want? lol

I know to limit some things obviously, but does it seem to work better if we eat a lot more?

[dawnyama]

Originally Posted by kj2010

So really, eat anything and everything except sugar and starch? Can I eat like 5 pieces of bacon with eggs and cheese if I want? lol

I know to limit some things obviously, but does it seem to work better if we eat a lot more?

For my first round that is how it went. I could eat pretty much anything and just avoid the sugar and starch and that worked well. Too well. I think I got spoiled to find out that it was not true in rounds 2 and beyond Once you get lower in weight (and to me, at goal) you have to adjust your calories because being at 140 (like post round 1) I could eat pretty much what I wanted. At 115, I could sooo not do that. I had to adjust the calories down. But it works!!!

[Jodarina]

Anybody eat Shiritaki noodles (miracle noodles) on P3? Was thinking of having some for lunch with a chicken curry sauce made with coconut cream.

[mousie tartufo]

Originally Posted by kj2010

So really, eat anything and everything except sugar and starch? Can I eat like 5 pieces of bacon with eggs and cheese if I want? lol

I know to limit some things obviously, but does it seem to work better if we eat a lot more?

Well, like Peggy said earlier, eat too little, you gain. Eat too much, you gain. You need to find YOUR calorie requirements.

Originally Posted by dawnyama

For my first round that is how it went. I could eat pretty much anything and just avoid the sugar and starch and that worked well. Too well. I think I got spoiled to find out that it was not true in rounds 2 and beyond Once you get lower in weight (and to me, at goal) you have to adjust your calories because being at 140 (like post round 1) I could eat pretty much what I wanted. At 115, I could sooo not do that. I had to adjust the calories down. But it works!!!

Well, to me that makes sense. I mean, it takes more energy to keep a 200+ pound person alive than it does a 150+ pound person. And more for one who weighs 140 versus 115. That's just basic biology. I'd also imagine (see, here's that scientific logic coming out again!) that the smaller you get, and the less fat you have, you can be "more sensitive" to things - not just toxins, but calories, lack of water, whatever.

As an example, say at 140 you were able to occasionally have a bagel with breakfast. Now at 115, that's just too much, and your system revolts. You gain weight, water, whatever your body needs to do to cope. This is true from an allergic standpoint at least - one of the body's defense mechanisms is to surround a toxin with fat - sort of encapsulate it so it can't do harm (MIL is allergic to everything, and hubby to quite a bit - we've become pseudo-experts LOL). This also explains why you can get pretty run-down or sick feeling when you detox/lose weight, because you're releasing all this stored 'poison'.

So, yeah, it makes sense to me, at least, that you'd need less - not only from a biological fuel perspective (smaller car, smaller gas tank!), but why you'd be so much more sensitive to "going over".

/puts away science goggles

[Jodarina]

Originally Posted by torister

Not true. My menu varies. I have a veggie with lunch and dinner typically and sometimes with bfast. If I am craving a veggie....and I *do* as I really love them...I eat it. Some days not as many. I try to keep things in balance. I am going to add some berries tonight as I am craving them. Just stay flexible and feed your body what it is asking for....and I don't mean chocolate...unless its SF! !

I don't think 1300 calories is nearly enough for you, but hopefully you will up that. Just stick to eat anything and everything except sugar and starch. It couldn't be easier than that. The scale will tell you what foods you are sensitive to or if you are not eating enough...and you adjust.

Thanks, that really takes the pressure off! Not doing so good getting in the calories so far today but about to make lunch with some coconut cream...that oughta crank up the calories. Man, this is a lot more fun than P2

Originally Posted by mousie tartufo

The formula I was referring to is the BMR calculation, the Harris-Benedict Equation. It determines your BMR (basal metabolic rate), which is the base amount of calories just to keep you alive. You figure that out, and then multiply the result by a predetermined factor to figure out how many calories you need per day, depending on your activity level.

Just my 5 cents worth - inflation, yo!

I'll try out the link for a BMR..thanks!

[dawnyama]

Originally Posted by mousie tartufo

Well, like Peggy said earlier, eat too little, you gain. Eat too much, you gain. You need to find YOUR calorie requirements.



Well, to me that makes sense. I mean, it takes more energy to keep a 200+ pound person alive than it does a 150+ pound person. And more for one who weighs 140 versus 115. That's just basic biology. I'd also imagine (see, here's that scientific logic coming out again!) that the smaller you get, and the less fat you have, you can be "more sensitive" to things - not just toxins, but calories, lack of water, whatever.

As an example, say at 140 you were able to occasionally have a bagel with breakfast. Now at 115, that's just too much, and your system revolts. You gain weight, water, whatever your body needs to do to cope. This is true from an allergic standpoint at least - one of the body's defense mechanisms is to surround a toxin with fat - sort of encapsulate it so it can't do harm (MIL is allergic to everything, and hubby to quite a bit - we've become pseudo-experts LOL). This also explains why you can get pretty run-down or sick feeling when you detox/lose weight, because you're releasing all this stored 'poison'.

So, yeah, it makes sense to me, at least, that you'd need less - not only from a biological fuel perspective (smaller car, smaller gas tank!), but why you'd be so much more sensitive to "going over".

/puts away science goggles

Alright. You have joined this forum a little too late Where were you when I NEEDED to hear that??!!! I had no idea that I would not be able to eat just as much at 115 than I did at 150. I was wondering why I was gaining on what I could, and did, eat in R1P3. I love to eat--and I can eat alot. I can outeat my DH, and he is taller than me by a full foot. Of course I should stop eating like food will not be available tomorrow. I know it, just wish I could shut that voice in my head that says "Eat. Eat now!!" And yes, I have found I am so much more sensitive to anything they add to foods in restaurants. I used to be able to eat anything Atkins (low carb) style pre hcg and not gain. Now I have found I can gain quite a bit on what I used to not gain an oz on.

[minimonkey]

Well, guys, I am trying to hang in there and just trust the process -- so am eating more today -- had an apple, but other than that it'll be protein and fat. I have added dairy back in, and I suppose that is so far so good -- I don't know how to interpret today's jump up in weight, because of TOM and exercise, but I am still in my window so not gonna sweat it. If I go overboard, I will do a correction day tomorrow, and just call it a learning experience.

I would rather have my hypothalamus reset at a higher calorie level if possible (most days, anyhow -- sometimes eating is just a chore!) -- so I will give this a fair shake. Plus, I do think my skin and muscles could really use some fat in the diet right now, as well as protein. Gallbladder is ok so far.

I am going to be exercising pretty regularly, so that should help with the reshaping --

Oh, to answer the reshaping question, a lot of people lose inches during p3, even with a stable weight... and skin tightens up as well. PLEASE!

[minimonkey]

Torister -- I never claimed to be rational or reasonable

Seriously, this is just old, stupid issues about food and control, coming up again due to having just done a low cal/low fat diet -- I chucked that mentality for a low-carb one years ago, but this diet has reactivated some old, deeply ingrained ideas. As soon as I see that I can be stable eating higher calories and lots of fat, I'll be fine.

I have read a ton of people saying just that -- and you are certainly a great example -- so I will trust that it will work.

I am definitely looking forward to some muscle building now, and that does require fuel -- and so does collagen building for skin... I know these things... I just "forget" them sometimes in the face of fear.

[minimonkey]

On the way plus side, I am feeling better yet today -- legs are stronger, and my concentration is back (it was dwindling badly at the end of p2, and my legs had gotten quite weak.) Tummy is a little unsure what to do with all the food, but it'll figure it out

[minimonkey]

Julie -- some day when I am feeling very brave, I will have some of the sugar free froyo from our local place -- not yet though!!! I do think I will try out some home made sugar free ice creams though -- I have an ice cream make I have never even used.

What are your (collective) thoughts on things like flax meal bread (no sugar, no other grains) ?? Lots of folks on another board are into it -- and seem to do ok... good or bad?

[BusyMomOf4]

I was fine with flax last round and still have been this round (even though other things previously okay are not now). I think the flax helps keep me regular. I love to have a minute muffin w/cream cheese in the morning along with some bacon or sausage.

[averyjenn]

Loving the eating high fats today! Yummo!!!

[minimonkey]

Love that avatar pic, Avery! You look fantastic!!!!!!!!!

[julieboolie]

Ditto-Jenn you look wonderful!!

Mini-I'd love an ice cream maker, but have not counter space now. I imagine I'd put it away and never use it too!!

Debby-flax does not agree w. me. Coconut oil either. Both make me gain - but many here at LCF do quite well with both. It's a YMMV thing. Give it a whirl and see what you think!!

Just got back from dd's conferences. My older dd did great in every area. Dd (7) who I strongly suspect is ADHD (not medicated or treated right now) had escalating behavioral issues. I know how impulsive she is, but lately she's been mean to the kids around her at school and the kids/parents are calling her a "bully" - which is the current buzz word. Anyway I talked with both her teacher and principal and am open for suggestions. We took her to a Dr. last year who diagnosed her as borderline ADHD, but b/c she's a straight A student didn't recommend treatment. We've tried everything I can think of, gluten free has helped some, and total diet makeover, but I think we need to see some professional. I am praying for a good one. I don't want her having to handle whatever challenge she's been dealt all on her own. She's becoming labelled and if she can't learn to control her words and actions, it's not going to improve. I am at a bit of a loss and want to cry. But I need to be the one to make it all better. Dh is ADHD and has anger issues and isn't very helpful in these types of situations. I tend to turn to food (chocolate is looking good right now) to comfort myself at times like this. But, instead I'm posting here, venting it and asking for prayer. I know that God made dd(7) just the way she is and want wisdom to find something to help her. I can't do it alone, so I'm praying for a good referral and helpful Dr.

Thanks for listening. It feels a bit better just getting that off my chest. I realize it's off-topic, but it's what's on my mind just now. Sorry!