Wound up in the emergency room

[StephStu]

Collapsed and ended up in the hospital emergency room. My doctor blasted me for how I was eating. He hates Atkins for Lupus patients.

So this is what he wants me to do: If I must do Atkins, he says do the original Atkins, and no less than 40 g of carbs a day, with lots of water and lots of fiber. He insists that I have at least one slice of whole wheat bread a day.

He's going to email me a food plan when he gets back to the office on Monday morning. He says it's more of a hypoglycemic, low GI diet, but it does restrict carbs and of course cuts out sugar.

I guess this goes under "Other" diet plans. I knew Atkins just wasn't working, and I could feel it was hurting me. It's not for everybody, I guess.

[brandy998]

There are some really good organic whole grain breads in the freezer section of my grocery store. I like what I call "rocks & gravel" bread and if you can tolerate it, it's pretty low carb for the most part and has lots of good fiber. Good luck & get healthy!

[BillB]

Maybe you should look at South Beach.

I hope your health problems clear up and that you feel better.



--bill

[hippiegirl]

Why is it bad for Lupus patients? (My mom has Lupus).

[Magicsmom]

SetphStu, you are right. It's not for everyone. It sounds like your doctor is very reasonable. A low GL diet would probably suit you very well. I'm sorry you went through all of that.

[AllieCat0817]

Originally Posted by StephStu

If I must do Atkins, he says do the original Atkins, and no less than 40 g of carbs a day, with lots of water and lots of fiber. He insists that I have at least one slice of whole wheat bread a day.

You can still lose weight on this (although I don't think it's original Atkins-- it's still Atkins - just the Ongoing Weight Loss phase).

Ongoing Weight Loss was the most satisfying, easiest to lose weight phase for me. A very very easy way for me to maintain my losses without adding in the extra 'tricky' stuff of PreMaint or Maint. I revert back to OWL often, I love it. A very SAFE zone.

An excellent whole wheat bread is Nature's Own Double Fiber. It will NOT ruin you! I love it, when I need to eat bread.

[nonstickpam107]

Hmmmm...I wonder why the doc said that too. And if you were doing the 'original Atkins' you'd not be eating bread, nor would you be at 40grams of carb.

I have autoimmune disease as well. I collect them (I couldn't find enough rocks to collect). I have: Hashimoto's (which walks hand in hand with Lupus, btw...does doctor care to do FT4 FT3, and TPO to check?), HIE (rare, Hyper IgE), Sjogrens (rare), PAN (polyarteritis nodosa) and Celiac. I take oral steroids DAILY and don't gain weight on this WOE.

The mention of South Beach is a great one. I lost my first 50 pounds on Protein Power by Dr. Michael Eades (and it explains lowcarb very well) BEFORE I was medicated for autiommune hypothyroidism. I know over 240 patients with Lupus through my advocacy (they all have Hashimoto's autoimmune hypothyroidism TOO) and all of them have lost weight, gotten healthier and kept it off eating lowcarb. And what would the doc want ya to eat if you also have Celiac and can't have any bread/flour/grains? Doctors like to blame things on WOE...and I'm one of 2600 patients who were MISdiagnosed as fibromyalgia cuz they didn't 'catch' the Hashimoto's.

Lowcarb doesn't mean 'no carb' nor does it mean 'no veggies, no water'. Make sure you are following the plan to the letter, and there ARE great plans that include lots of fiber and they are still considered 'lowcarb'. I'll have to be without gluten, and a LOT of foods (HIE is the disease that makes you allergic to just about anything on any given day) because of my disease, but I get in about 65grams of carb on a non workout day and around 80 on a work out day.

I'm with the doctor on eating healthy...lower the carbs..don't omit them. Eat healthy...good organic foods, natural foods.

Pam

[JazzleBug]

Ouch. My favorite breads are Ezekiel Bread found in the refrigerated/freezer section and AllieCat's rec, Nature's Own Double Fiber. Take care of yourself, girly.

[oyvey]

I'm sorry. Relapses are crap.

I have MS, and I definitely don't eat traditional early level Atkins stuff. There are many people that believe that a VLC diet isn't appropriate for those of us with autoimmune conditions. For people without autoimmune conditions, they seem to be able to compensate. But not us.

I'm surprised that your doc wants you to eat whole grain bread, as there's a pretty strong consensus that gluten isn't great for MS patients or for lupus patients and that cutting it out can decrease symptoms. That's been true for me.

I definitely eat more than 40 carbs a day (a recent day I tracked was somewhere around 75-100). I eat it in unlimited vegetables (with an emphasis on dark/green), a fruit or two, and sometimes quinoa or brown rice. I eat a bit of dairy (fermented), but if it came down to it, that'd be the next thing I'd cut out.

Anyhow, if you feel like PM'ing me, we can talk more. I've got a bunch of friends with lupus (and with MS), and am in medical school, so I think about autoimmunity, well, a lot.

Are you on steroids right now? That makes losing weight a hassle, which I'm sure you know.

Best to you.

[BillB]

Temporary threadjack...

AllieCat, you look beautiful. Nice to see you "still around"!



--bill

[hippiegirl]

Originally Posted by nonstickpam107

Hmmmm...I wonder why the doc said that too. And if you were doing the 'original Atkins' you'd not be eating bread, nor would you be at 40grams of carb.

I have autoimmune disease as well. I collect them (I couldn't find enough rocks to collect). I have: Hashimoto's (which walks hand in hand with Lupus, btw...does doctor care to do FT4 FT3, and TPO to check?), HIE (rare, Hyper IgE), Sjogrens (rare), PAN (polyarteritis nodosa) and Celiac. I take oral steroids DAILY and don't gain weight on this WOE.

The mention of South Beach is a great one. I lost my first 50 pounds on Protein Power by Dr. Michael Eades (and it explains lowcarb very well) BEFORE I was medicated for autiommune hypothyroidism. I know over 240 patients with Lupus through my advocacy (they all have Hashimoto's autoimmune hypothyroidism TOO) and all of them have lost weight, gotten healthier and kept it off eating lowcarb. And what would the doc want ya to eat if you also have Celiac and can't have any bread/flour/grains? Doctors like to blame things on WOE...and I'm one of 2600 patients who were MISdiagnosed as fibromyalgia cuz they didn't 'catch' the Hashimoto's.

Lowcarb doesn't mean 'no carb' nor does it mean 'no veggies, no water'. Make sure you are following the plan to the letter, and there ARE great plans that include lots of fiber and they are still considered 'lowcarb'. I'll have to be without gluten, and a LOT of foods (HIE is the disease that makes you allergic to just about anything on any given day) because of my disease, but I get in about 65grams of carb on a non workout day and around 80 on a work out day.

I'm with the doctor on eating healthy...lower the carbs..don't omit them. Eat healthy...good organic foods, natural foods.

Pam

My mom has sjogrens, too.

I'd really like to encourage my mom to do lc, especially since she's recently added diabetes to her roster (she also has fibromyalgia and rheumatoid arthritis ).

[peanutte]

You can still lose weight on this (although I don't think it's original Atkins-- it's still Atkins - just the Ongoing Weight Loss phase).

Ongoing Weight Loss was the most satisfying, easiest to lose weight phase for me. A very very easy way for me to maintain my losses without adding in the extra 'tricky' stuff of PreMaint or Maint. I revert back to OWL often, I love it. A very SAFE zone.

I know, it's great. And it really is a legitimate option for people to do Atkins but to start at OWL levels or even at Maintenance levels. Some people do better with more carbs.

[fawn]

You might also search this board. We had a heavy poster named anniemo who managed her lupus on a very low carb diet.

I believe Annie also did incredibly well with coconut and cod liver oil for what it's worth.

I'm not sure the doc is "up" on nutritional recommendations for your condition so again, you might find a good support group.

[hippiegirl]

I miss anniemo. I wonder why she quit posting.

[Linny]

Lots of great advice here.......I have chronic lyme disease and been battling it for a very long time. LD can wreak havoc on your kidneys and so can the medications I take to treat my LD. With those two alone, you would think I was very high risk for kidney damage.

After following LC and most recently VLC, my labs show that my kidneys are function the best they have ever functioned.

Are you eating whole natural foods? I avoid processed foods like the plague. I believe 100% in LC or VLC........I really hope you find more answers to what made you pass out.

[Magicsmom]

Originally Posted by hippiegirl

My mom has sjogrens, too.

I'd really like to encourage my mom to do lc, especially since she's recently added diabetes to her roster (she also has fibromyalgia and rheumatoid arthritis ).

I find it interesting that fibromyalgia goes hand in hand with autoimmune disorders. I have Hashimoto's, an unnamed autoimmune disorder that attacks my immune system itself, and fibromyalgia. I've even read that they think fibromyalgia is autoimmune, but not everyone agrees with that. Has your mom's doctor ever said anything about that?

[jem51]

what testing did they do in the ER? did i miss that?

[Gulf Coast Girl]

Originally Posted by hippiegirl

Why is it bad for Lupus patients? (My mom has Lupus).

I have Lupus and it was actually my Dr's that recommended LC (both to lose the steroid related weight gain and as a way to control inflammation since I was losing that help from the steroids when I stopped them).

Interestingly, the lower my carbs are the higher every single one of my inflammation marker's are BUT most of the time I don't suffer from the pain I should be feeling from those high numbers.

Pre low carb - even with all the steroids - I felt a million times more pain with lower marker numbers than I do with much higher numbers on LC.

The Dr's aren't concerned with the high numbers as long as I'm feeling well and my liver/kidney numbers stay within range. If/when either of those start to change then we have to reevaluate LC. I've had to do that a couple times during my LC journey so far but each time the elevation turned out to be med not food related.

People with autoimmune issues need to be honest with and work closely with their dr's regardless of eating plans. (I say that because so many times I've seen people here say 'I didn't tell my Dr I'm eating LC' for those with serious medical issues I think that's playing with fire.)

[Minnas]

Originally Posted by StephStu

Collapsed and ended up in the hospital emergency room. My doctor blasted me for how I was eating. He hates Atkins for Lupus patients.

So this is what he wants me to do: If I must do Atkins, he says do the original Atkins, and no less than 40 g of carbs a day, with lots of water and lots of fiber. He insists that I have at least one slice of whole wheat bread a day.

He's going to email me a food plan when he gets back to the office on Monday morning. He says it's more of a hypoglycemic, low GI diet, but it does restrict carbs and of course cuts out sugar.

I guess this goes under "Other" diet plans. I knew Atkins just wasn't working, and I could feel it was hurting me. It's not for everybody, I guess.

Did you mention the 7 day Master Cleanse you did recently to him? I think that was you right? I wonder if that had anything to do with you landing in the hospital?

[Vanessa120]

Originally Posted by StephStu

Collapsed and ended up in the hospital emergency room. My doctor blasted me for how I was eating. He hates Atkins for Lupus patients.

So this is what he wants me to do: If I must do Atkins, he says do the original Atkins, and no less than 40 g of carbs a day, with lots of water and lots of fiber. He insists that I have at least one slice of whole wheat bread a day.

He's going to email me a food plan when he gets back to the office on Monday morning. He says it's more of a hypoglycemic, low GI diet, but it does restrict carbs and of course cuts out sugar.

I guess this goes under "Other" diet plans. I knew Atkins just wasn't working, and I could feel it was hurting me. It's not for everybody, I guess.

I am sorry you ended up in the emergency room. However, if I had Lupus I would definately steer clear of wheat and any gluten containing products! Out of curiosity what was a typical days menu like for you while following Atkin's?

[StephStu]

O.K., I'll try to answer all the questions. Sorry if this is long.

I have lupus w/fibro and CFS. Enlarged thyroid, but not Hashimoto's, and levels are on the low side of normal. I don't have any food allergies, no celiac, nothing like that. I do have a malabsorption disorder which makes me have to take mega doses of vitamins daily, which was caused by stress induced ulcerative colitis many years ago. My colon is badly scarred from that.

I also have occasional, not serious, bouts of hypoglycemia, which is also why I probably got addicted to carbs. They didn't mention low blood sugar at the ER.

I did tell him about the Master Cleanse. He likes MC for no more than 10 days, because he is very much into natural/holistic methods. He believes it's actually good for autoimmune patients, and I find it helps a lot with my pain when I do it.

They took blood. No results back yet, except Hematocrit, which was fine. Temperature was up (mine is normally 97 to 97.5), 99.3. No infection, but high inflammation. He said the temp could be from ketosis.

I can't take steroids, and have no insurance, so can't afford whatever the other meds are. Steroids cause fluid to build up in my chest and lungs.

He told me when I said I wanted to do low carb that he didn't think it would work for me.

The bread? Don't have a clue, except for the fiber maybe? I eat Nature's Own 7 grain, which doesn't have a ton of fiber. I love Ezekial bread, and plan to buy some.

I think the reason he said the original Atkins was because you could eat whatever as long as you stayed in the carb limits? Anyway, I'm not going to do any Atkins anymore, because I think if you can't do it right, just don't do it.

He doesn't like the mood swings with very low carb like Induction, because I have depression, but also have a genetic predispostion to build up tolerance to drugs very easily (addiction gene), and then they don't work anymore, even at highest allowable doses for my size/weight. It usually only takes about 6 months for them to stop working, so I just don't take them.

I also have what they call PVC's (premature ventricular contractions), which is when your heart feels like it's skipping a beat. It's a heart arrythmia. I knew it was getting worse on the Induction diet. That may be what caused me to collapse. I've been very tired lately, very sleepy, getting more than 8 hrs sleep a night, which is strange for me.

So who knows? Anyway, I want to do what he says. He's sending the diet plan tomorrow, so we'll see what it entails. I'm still very, very tired. Went to bed early last night and slept 10 hours.

Thanks for all the support!

[ppuente]

Just wanted to say I hope everything works out for you and you feel better soon.

[Blood Sugar 101]

From what I've been reading lately I would suggest that you up your carbs a bit, eat a lot more LC greens and colorful fresh vegetables but eat NO gluten or Soy.

Gluten and soy are linked to producing auto immune problems, probably because the soy damages the gut lining and lets the large protein molecules through.

I have heard from a few people who have severe autoimmune conditions (RA, LADA diabetes, a form of Type 1) who do better eating more carbs but eliminating a lot of various kinds of food proteins--because the proteins trigger antibodies and cause severe flares.

This can lead to a very restrictive diet, but if you can eliminate the problem proteins and see the flares calm down you may then slowly add them back in to see which ones you can eat safely.

Autoimmune disease involve a completely different set of issues from Insulin Resistance so the very low carb diet with a high protein component might be dangerous for someone whose autoimmune condition is one that responds to problem proteins.

I wish I could refer you to a source on this, but it is something I am just learning, led by my correspondents who have been pioneering diet treatments for the non-thyroid autoimmune conditions.

[hippiegirl]

Originally Posted by Gulf Coast Girl

I have Lupus and it was actually my Dr's that recommended LC (both to lose the steroid related weight gain and as a way to control inflammation since I was losing that help from the steroids when I stopped them).

Interestingly, the lower my carbs are the higher every single one of my inflammation marker's are BUT most of the time I don't suffer from the pain I should be feeling from those high numbers.

Pre low carb - even with all the steroids - I felt a million times more pain with lower marker numbers than I do with much higher numbers on LC.

The Dr's aren't concerned with the high numbers as long as I'm feeling well and my liver/kidney numbers stay within range. If/when either of those start to change then we have to reevaluate LC. I've had to do that a couple times during my LC journey so far but each time the elevation turned out to be med not food related.

People with autoimmune issues need to be honest with and work closely with their dr's regardless of eating plans. (I say that because so many times I've seen people here say 'I didn't tell my Dr I'm eating LC' for those with serious medical issues I think that's playing with fire.)

Thank you for this information!


StephStu - I hope you feel better soon!

[fawn]

I did tell him about the Master Cleanse. He likes MC for no more than 10 days, because he is very much into natural/holistic methods.

I'm sorry steph but I'm not sure what Dr. would encourage someone with your symptoms the master cleanse. Please be careful with ths one. It's poor advice.

[Lickrish]

Originally Posted by StephStu

I also have what they call PVC's (premature ventricular contractions), which is when your heart feels like it's skipping a beat. It's a heart arrythmia. I knew it was getting worse on the Induction diet. That may be what caused me to collapse. I've been very tired lately, very sleepy, getting more than 8 hrs sleep a night, which is strange for me.


Thanks for all the support!

I have PVC too! I had surgery earlier this year and came out of anesthesia and they were freaking out over my heart rate. Did about 3 EKG's and then sent me straight to a cardiologist while I was still under the medication. bleh.They made me wear a heart monitor for a couple of days and
they put me on beta blockers which makes weight loss difficult and I still have the PVC's. I have them about every 5 heart beats. They are scary.
Family has asked if low carb caused them.
I've been sleeping lately like you described and usually I'm super insomniac. I just figured it was the time change.

[Strawberry]

How on earth does your doctor explain your diet being related to a lupus flare?

I'm sorry, but I have an advanced degree in immunology and an MD (medical doctor), and I dont see the connection to low carb.

He needs to focus on HIS JOB, which is managing your immunosuppression. Not a diet.

Have you talked with your doctor (or possibly a NEW doctor) about the cost of medications?
Often there are ways to get free samples from drug companies and many drug companies have programs for reduced cost drugs for patients who qualify.

[fawn]

Originally Posted by Strawberry

How on earth does your doctor explain your diet being related to a lupus flare?

I'm sorry, but I have an advanced degree in immunology and an MD (medical doctor), and I dont see the connection to low carb.

He needs to focus on HIS JOB, which is managing your immunosuppression. Not a diet.

Have you talked with your doctor (or possibly a NEW doctor) about the cost of medications?
Often there are ways to get free samples from drug companies and many drug companies have programs for reduced cost drugs for patients who qualify.

I believe if a lupus patient was consuming poor quality foods such as vegetable oils, this could cause a flare up would you agree strawberry? I think the MC could do it!

[homestretch]

Sounds like a healthy low carb diet would be ideal. I am not an MD but you can increase your carbs through vegetables, berries, and yogurt all which would have health benefits that are not present in a piece of bread. Just my two cents. As far as doing all or nothing Atkins. I think there are many people who skip induction and move into OWL which is simply a healthy diet.

[teri f]

Originally Posted by homestretch

Sounds like a healthy low carb diet would be ideal. I am not an MD but you can increase your carbs through vegetables, berries, and yogurt all which would have health benefits that are not present in a piece of bread. Just my two cents. As far as doing all or nothing Atkins. I think there are many people who skip induction and move into OWL which is simply a healthy diet.

I agree. I just can't get my brain around why a piece of bread is going to help a lupus flair up?? Sure hope you feel better soon though.