~*~BiPolar Folks~*~

[djalomo]

Originally Posted by Seelessofme

Can any of you help me? My BFF just started lithium a couple of days ago. She is experiencing side effects (headache, confusion, exhaustion, nausea) and is worried that she won't be able to take lithium. Her psychiatrist isn't calling her back. Did anyone have strong side effects that subsided with time?

I haven't been on Lithium but on Geodon I had really really strong side effects that did subside with time. My doc said they would fade in 4 weeks and they really did. It was a rough 4 weeks though, but well worth it for the kind of stability I felt. I was unable to continue the drug thought because over time it tipped me into the manic side.

I had a few minor side effects with Lamictal, and those also faded with time. But they were very, very minor in relation to the trade off.

[Seelessofme]

She worries that lamictal will dampen the mania, but not treat the depression. Do you find that to be true?

Thank you so much for your help. She is too worried to ask questions herself.

[djalomo]

Originally Posted by Seelessofme

She worries that lamictal will dampen the mania, but not treat the depression. Do you find that to be true?

Thank you so much for your help. She is too worried to ask questions herself.

Well, I personally found my depression feel like it lifted about a week in, but the dosage titration is tricky and can be frustrating. It's a drug that really takes a long time to build up in your system to work - you might feel some relief very soon but that may fade until your body is able to take what's called the 'theureputic dose.' You start at 25 or 50mg and work your way up to about 100 or 150mgs very slowly over a few months or so.

But, I do feel crazy depressed when we switch my dose for a day or two, then I wake up feeling normal.

I hear Abilify is good at lifting the depression. I lean much more toward the depressive side myself, but so far Lamictal's giving me so few side effects so I'm sticking the long titration out. I haven't had a weight gain issue and that was a HUGE deal for me. I can't stand the hungry-around-the-clock feeling I had with other drugs. On Geodon I put on about 7 lbs over a week. That's not even calorically possible really.

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by Seelessofme

Can any of you help me? My BFF just started lithium a couple of days ago. She is experiencing side effects (headache, confusion, exhaustion, nausea) and is worried that she won't be able to take lithium. Her psychiatrist isn't calling her back. Did anyone have strong side effects that subsided with time?

I have never used Lithium, Maybe Heather will help with that.

Originally Posted by Seelessofme

She worries that lamictal will dampen the mania, but not treat the depression. Do you find that to be true?

Thank you so much for your help. She is too worried to ask questions herself.

It took a couple of weeks before I adjusted to lamictal and the symptoms were quite like that at first. I was pretty spacey.

I have found that Lamictal is effective in both highs and lows. I have had some small depressions now and again, and a short term increase in Lamictal brought be back out of it and after a few days I returned to my usual dose.

[Houston Heather]

Very, very common.

Questions to ask: Is she taking it with food? You MUST do that. You need to drink a lot of water/liquid too, and not just 10 cups of coffee a day.

You have to give it time. My side effects got "better" eventually.

IMO, from what I have seen, NOTHING is as effective as lithium for bipolar symptoms, but I was a zombie for a while after I started it.

For me, it was easy. My symptoms were like living in a horrible horror movie. What was worse? Lithium, or that?

Easy choice, I'll take the fatigue and nausea anyday. Bipolar is HARSH. In my opinion, you are going to suffer in some manner if you want to get it under control. I feel comfortable with the lithium side effects.

My symptoms were terrible before diagnosis. I would not have survived the year.

You have to remember a few facts: half of everyone with this illness ADMITS to trying to kill themselves at least once. 10 percent have PROVEN to have killed themselves intentionally. I feel the numbers are higher, because many people plan the suicide to look like an accident.

Some cancers only kill 3-5% of the people who catch them. If you had cancer, what side effects would you be willing to endure?

I feel my illness is more serious than cancer, deadly serious, so I accept what I have to in order to manage my illness.

I will not go off medication until I die. Will not do it.

I am terrified to skip a dose when I have a migraine, like I do now, NOTHING is as scary as my unmedicated symptoms... I'd do just about ANYTHING to avoid that.

Tired? Nausea? Better than the alternative!

I ride the bus, I have met at least a dozen homeless men, alcoholics, who live within a 5 mile radius of my home. I mention my illness and they say "Oh, yeah, I have that too. But I won't take pills!". And there they are, literally living under the overpass, begging for beer money in 100+ degree heat, because they won't take their pills. Obviously other issues, but very, very telling.

Not me.

For me, lithium works to control ups, downs, mixed, and psychotic (hallucinations, delusions, and paranoia).

[djalomo]

Wow. That's an awesome post, Heather.

[faithgirl]

I agree Heather, that is an awesome post. Especially the part about cancer-we would all do what we needed to if we had cancer and just accept that there are side effects. I think the suicide statistics are higher as well-so many are not diagnosed at all and if they commit suicide someone will say it was over money or a relationship or something like that. Yours is a post worth keeping as a reminder to continue with treatment even when it doesn't seem to be working.

[Seelessofme]

Thank you, Heather.

I appreciate all of the time and energy so many of you took in answering my questions.

[Houston Heather]

Thanks!

I am 10000% convinced that's why God let my illness get so bad before diagnosis... it was horrible. I'd do ANYTHING to prevent that.

My husband was making a list of "good things" today, and me taking my pills was right up there at the top!

[faithgirl]

I am getting worse-really angry and more manic. I called the pdoc office to see if they could get me in sooner. Schedular was really nice and is working on it. Depends on if the available doc will take my insurance as to whether I can get in today or not. If not, then hopefully early next week. I'm freaking out about it, but I know it's necessary.

[djalomo]

Originally Posted by faithgirl

I am getting worse-really angry and more manic. I called the pdoc office to see if they could get me in sooner. Schedular was really nice and is working on it. Depends on if the available doc will take my insurance as to whether I can get in today or not. If not, then hopefully early next week. I'm freaking out about it, but I know it's necessary.

Hmmm, are you freaking about a possible bipo diagnosis and med side effects? Not everyone gets them. In fact, Lamictal so far is making me beyond uninterested in food. LOL. I had a really horrible dry mouth at first but that went away. Like Heather said, the side effects outweigh the illness by far for me.

If it does turn out to be your dignosis you will feel so much better once you are properly treated. It might take a while to find the right drug and will take some time finding it but you'll get there.

[faithgirl]

I'm freaking out mostly becuase anything new freaks me out, but also becuase we're going to talk about stuff I never talk about to anyone face to face, you know? I talk to you guys about it and an email friend, and have barely mentioned it to a couple of other people. What if the doc thinks I'm crazy? Or not crazy enough? I know, that should classify me as crazy just for thinking like that. I'm going to be judged, you know?

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by faithgirl

I am getting worse-really angry and more manic. I called the pdoc office to see if they could get me in sooner. Schedular was really nice and is working on it. Depends on if the available doc will take my insurance as to whether I can get in today or not. If not, then hopefully early next week. I'm freaking out about it, but I know it's necessary.

Originally Posted by faithgirl

I'm freaking out mostly becuase anything new freaks me out, but also becuase we're going to talk about stuff I never talk about to anyone face to face, you know? I talk to you guys about it and an email friend, and have barely mentioned it to a couple of other people. What if the doc thinks I'm crazy? Or not crazy enough? I know, that should classify me as crazy just for thinking like that. I'm going to be judged, you know?

By the Pdoc or the general population? Keep in mind that every single person has something that they are 'unusual' about. And everyone judges EVERYONE. we just have something cooler to talk about than most

[faithgirl]

By the pdoc. I figure I'm getting judged by my weight by everyone else.

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by faithgirl

By the pdoc. I figure I'm getting judged by my weight by everyone else.

Pdocs do nut judge, I promise. They study, are interested and sometimes fascinated, But they have seen way worse that anything you have ever done. Truly. id you are not 100% up front and honest they can not help you as you deserve to be helped. You shortchange yourself.

[faithgirl]

Originally Posted by CurveControl

Pdocs do nut judge, I promise. They study, are interested and sometimes fascinated, But they have seen way worse that anything you have ever done. Truly. id you are not 100% up front and honest they can not help you as you deserve to be helped. You shortchange yourself.

Okay. I don't want him to be fascinated by me either though.


I really appreciate everyone's support here. It has helped me in more ways than you can imagine.

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by faithgirl

Okay. I don't want him to be fascinated by me either though.


I really appreciate everyone's support here. It has helped me in more ways than you can imagine.

mine is fascinated by me. The fact that I have been married 20 years is a bit unusual for Bipolar people. Some of my past family history is freaky and he gets a kick out of that too, But the fact that I met and married someone who doesn't drink, not beat, nor cheat and yet still put up with my moods and general oddness is somewhat of a miracle.

[djalomo]

I guarantee you that whatever it is you tell your pdoc is very likely stuff they've heard before. They're fascinated, and the human brain is capable of much, much more 'shocking' things than you're probably afflicted with. Really, don't sweat it - just be as HONEST as you can.

My doc is fascinated by me too - they've all been. They've said my ability to articulate what I've felt in writing is like an essay in a study of straight-up Bipolar II.

[faithgirl]

I am PISSED!!!!! The appointment was a freaking nightmare! This place had the feel of a walk-in clinic complete with plastic folding chairs in the reception area and wallpaper that was put up in 1982. Here's a hint-when you take down the plaques that have been up for 20 years, either wash the wall or put up something bigger to hide that dirt outline of the original plaque-okay?

OMG, the doctor didn't give a rats ass about me or anything I had to say. He asked me THREE times what medications I was on. And kept repeating other questions over and over. Oh, and when he asks me about stressors and I tell him about the job from hell I get no reaction WHATSOEVER. Then I tell him about my mom having alzheimers and my dad's recent decision to make her DNR. I cannot even get the words out and I freaking start crying. Do I get any sympathy or an sense he cares at all? Nope. Not one bit, just goes on asking me questions while I fall apart. Thanks. I enjoy talking about the most singularly painful thing in my life to someone that could care less. The whole appointment took less than 20 minutes. And when I first came in I told him I had depression, panic attacks and I suspected bipolar. 15 minutes later when we go over the ADs I've taken in the past, I tell him that Zoloft and Cymbalta made me manic. He looks at me and says, oh, are you bipolar? WTH??? I was hoping you could tell me buddy!

THEN when I'm making an appointment for the next appointment (which I am not keeping), this woman that works in the office starts screaming and cursing at a patient and telling him to get out! I was in shock. I could not believe it. The other office staff just stared at her and then they start looking at me like, oh crap, a witness!

This whole thing was just unbelievable. I mean I was freaked out enough as it was and it was worse than I ever imagined. I cried the whole 40 mile trip home.

He did give me 3 weeks worth of samples of Abilify, but I don;t know if I should take it. I am not going back under any circumstances. Maybe I could get my regular doc to RX it if it works, but I am so pissed I just want to get off of everything and say screw it. If I survive, geat, if not, I don't really care.

[faithgirl]

Oh yeah, and I didn;t have to worry that I would be judged by him because he wasn't even interested.

And this is what it says about this doctor on his practice's website when describing him: He is well known and respected for his loyalty and caring nature to his patients.

He is the center's director and he has recently bought two of the mental health hospitals in the area. I have no idea if there is more than two or not, but let me tell you, if I ever feel like killing myself, I am going to go through with it and not go to the hospital becuase I think I would be better off dead.

[CurveControl]

yup. New doc!!! I would call your primary tell them what happened so they don't refer any more patients there, then see if they will refill the Abilify until you find a new Pdoc. I wouldn't start if if you won't be able to refill it.

[faithgirl]

Originally Posted by CurveControl

yup. New doc!!! I would call your primary tell them what happened so they don't refer any more patients there, then see if they will refill the Abilify until you find a new Pdoc. I wouldn't start if if you won't be able to refill it.

You mean new doc for me or new doc in general? He has been practicing for 24 years.

[CurveControl]

A different Pdoc. And let your regular doc know about the jerk so they don't ever send him business again.

[faithgirl]

Is this something I have to look forward to? More of this kind of crap?

[CurveControl]

there are good doctors and bad doctors in every specialty. You have to find your fit. It took me several tries to get a good Pdoc.
And 2 to even find a regular doctor I would work with when we moved to Ohio.

[Houston Heather]

No, mine rocks.

Since I was already diagnosed, and I suspect he had talked to my aunt, my first appt was pretty brief. I walked in obviously mixed. I told him, I understand you'll put me on a cocktail. I'd like lithium for my mood stabilizer. He was surprised, but said OK. I told him, it worked for my mother when she didn't drink, so it ought to work for me. He was impressed I had done my research. He verified I didn't have insurance. He asked if I had family with me. I said yes, my aunt and husband. He brought them in and explained the medication routine.

Oh, yeah, and I gave him an afghan I made. He's still talking about that afghan. I was so manic when I made it I barely remember it... but he sure loves it the way he goes on! I'm glad it means so much to him.

I mentioned, by the way, I see things that aren't there and I get really paranoid. He goes, OK, and hands me another box of medication (my antipsychotic). He is one of the start low docs, which is good.

I take 600-1200 mg of lithium a day, depending on symptoms (low dose)
2.5 mg Lexapro (one half the smallest dose)
.125 Risperdal (half the smallest dose, I could probably go up on it , but resent being psychotic and having to take a pill).

I know what you mean about killing yourself rather than go back. Before I found my doc, I went to the county mental health clinic. Horrible paperwork. Scary people. All the staff were behind bulletproof glass. You had to bring tons of documentation, an armed guard took you to the bathroom and waited outside... I was completely manic and then some idiot throws the fire alarm in the middle of my interview.

The lady who interviewed me was like "We shouldn't let you go home like this, but you're not a danger to yourself or others." She, like, begged me to tell her I had support. Fortunately I did... then she tells me "I don't know how long you'll have to wait, but it could be months, in the meantime, if you want to hurt yourself or someone else call 911".

Months later, I got a call to go into the county clinic. By this time my aunt had found me my doc. I wondered briefly if I should go.. then when I called to cancel they said "Who are you? You're not in our system! If you want an appointment you need to be evaluated and go on the waiting list!" Oh. My. God. I would rather DIE.

My doc trains other psychiatrists in practice. I am always happy to let them sit in on our "visits" because who will be there for me after he's gone?

I read an article in our paper. Only 40 p-docs in Texas take Medicaid, and Medicaid is being a butt about paying the few docs they do have on the rolls. UGH.

A fascinating aspect of my doc, he insists that Ron come with me, so he can get an accurate feel for my moods. He says the married patients always do better than the singles, because the spouse can tell when they're cycling. Plus, he likes us as a couple.

[faithgirl]

Thanks Molly and Heather. I am just so frustrated. All I read are bad things about Abilify like it can throw someone bipolar into mania but the manufacturer somehow wrangled approval for bipolar anyway. I, of course, still don't know if he diagnosed me with bipolar. It seemed like he thought I was but that was based on the fact that I got manic on 2 ADs. I never did get to tell him that I was hypo last year when not on anything at all. He didn't ask of course. I really don't know what to do.

[CurveControl]

most any of them can Kathleen. The brain chemistry is a delicate thing, and messing with it will have side effects, especially at first. When I try to increase my Lamictal too fast I can get a little hypo. There is no perfect BiPo med for all BiPo patients, we have to find our treatment individually. I was lucky in that my 1st med 'took' I did drop the 2nd med in my original coctail, I didn't need it. DJ has had to try a bunch that just didn't work for her, and seems to be just now settling in with one that helps her.

[Houston Heather]

I told my husband I hate being "stupid" at times, but he is very understanding. In fact, he played the line from "Ten Feet Tall and Bulletproof" to tease me:
"I start to feel like Superman..
Then I pick a fight..."

That was so me, yesterday, before I took another lithium!

I lost some money today and realized, hours later, I had it in my purse. I didn't feel too sharp - but it's so much better than the alternative.

The lithium side effect list can be horrifying, but I just get a little thick at times, dry mouth, etc.

I seldom get dehydrated as a result!

[djalomo]

Hey! We're celebrities. One of the threads here about water retention on Rispiredal made a Bipolar Luv Tweet over at Twitter. Their name is bpluv over there.