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Old 06-11-2013, 09:19 AM   #1
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Read too much, now confused...

Hi gang..

I've been back on LC 5 weeks.
I lose slowly - maybe because of my age but I am down about 7 pounds. I never got that "woosh" because I was on a calorie counting diet and didn't have bunches of glycogen to start with to give me a bunch of water weight loss. I'm happy with the weight loss though because I understand it.

Here is my problem:
I never get much energy on low carb and never gave myself enough time to get the energy apparently. In the past I would always fall off about a month in because I just felt like a constant slug. Now after reading lots of literature on nutritional ketosis, including "The Art and Science" I know I have to build up mitochondria and that for some people it can take 6-8 weeks for their body to get efficient in using fat for energy.

I started walking a couple of days ago and feel like I am just walking thru mud, it's such a struggle and it's already so freaking HOT her. In the past I would end up giving up now because I would feel like exercise should not be so freaking hard. My energy is nill, really, really not there.

I read that I should do high intensity to help build mitochondria but right now there is just no way. I do good to do a normal walk for 20 min. I know it SHOULD get better but how long?

Here is where I get confused about exercise: just what burns fat and just what will be asking my body to search for glycogen stores? I thought that walking was pretty much just using fat for energy but that more exertion.. more cardio would look for muscle glycogen.. which I am pretty sure I have next to none.

I feel a tiny bit of encouragement to get off my arse and exercise but this is frustrating!!! What will help me the quickest and can someone please help me understand the difference between exercise that will use fat for energy and exercise that will push my body to want to use glycogen.?

TIA!
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Old 06-11-2013, 11:02 AM   #2
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I don't think you should worry about exercise at this point. you can lose a LOT from the diet alone, and you should give your body a fair chance to adapt to it, I believe. good luck! *hug*
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Old 06-11-2013, 11:31 AM   #3
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It might be too soon before you become truly ketoadaoted . Also , high intensity means weight bearing excercise not high endurance like high aerobic. Check out excercise board!
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Old 06-11-2013, 11:53 AM   #4
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Hi Cary... good to 'see' you! I agree with Ravenrose. Don't worry about exercise for now. Great job on the lost lbs. so far!!
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Old 06-11-2013, 12:41 PM   #5
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If you want to keep exercising there are tons of ways to do a HIIT (high intensity interval training) workout indoors. Just sprint in place or do some jumping jacks for about a minute, then recover for a minute. Then just do as many intervals as your energy allows. You could start with 5 min and work up to 15-20 in the future...and you can stay in the AC If you google indoor HIIT you'll see lots of ideas.
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Old 06-11-2013, 01:56 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jesship View Post
If you want to keep exercising there are tons of ways to do a HIIT (high intensity interval training) workout indoors. Just sprint in place or do some jumping jacks for about a minute, then recover for a minute. Then just do as many intervals as your energy allows. You could start with 5 min and work up to 15-20 in the future...and you can stay in the AC If you google indoor HIIT you'll see lots of ideas.
I am not sure I would suggest someone at twice her goal weight do jumping jacks! this sounds like an invitation to knee injury.
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Old 06-11-2013, 04:45 PM   #7
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Hi!

Thanks for the advise to just take it slow. I tend to get obsessive sometimes.

Yes.. Jumping jacks are not quite doable for me right now.. like I mentioned in my post I have a very hard time just having energy to WALK.. much less sprinting in place or jumping around.

I do want to keep walking because it gets me out of the house. I work from home and sit all day long.

I am positive that as the weight comes off I will feel more up to movement. I can't wait to feel lighter and more free in my body.
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:32 PM   #8
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Is there somewhere you can swim?

You could try interval training. You exercise for a while (walk, swim, bike, whatever) and then increase your intensity until you are uncomfortable. Stay there (uncomfortable) for a bit (10 seconds or so at first, then increase the time) then back off to recover.

You can build fitness pretty quickly that way, without it being toooo difficult because you are only doing the really hard exercise in short bursts.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:32 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanilingo View Post
It might be too soon before you become truly ketoadaoted . Also , high intensity means weight bearing excercise not high endurance like high aerobic. Check out excercise board!
High Intensity means leaving the high aerobic zone. You can do this riding a bike which is basically, non-weight bearing.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:37 PM   #10
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I'm sorry, I didn't mean to suggest something that would hurt you. That was a really bad example. I have a bad knee myself (was diagnosed with juvenile rhuemetoid arthritis at 2) and tend to just automatically modify my exercise for my knee. What I was just trying to say is the interval training can be easily modified to what is comfortable for you...you can start at just 5 min at a time with short bursts at your full capability. Ignore the sprinting and jumping jacks suggestion (sorry again). What GME said is basically what I was trying to say...but in a much better way
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:00 PM   #11
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The increase in mitochondria and the size of mitochondria will come through training. The change in mitochondria will accept both fat and glycogen for energy production but with the increase in size and amount of mitochondria comes an increase in the mitochondria enzyme.......

I can't explain on why your body wants to search for more glycogen stores but here is the best explanation on how training will allow to burn more fat at any level of exercise, even standing still.

from the Lore of Running, Tim Nokes md

"However when the number and volume of mitochondria increase as the result of training, the immediate effect is that the immediate effect of each mitochondria to produce ATP at any free fatty acid concentration in the blood in greatly inhanced. Thus, at any rate of energy production (exercise intensity), each mitochondria will be able to work at a higher ATP:ADP ratio and will therefore be less dependent on carbohydrate metabolism for energy.

This means that after training, fat can provide more energy at higher exercise intensities than it could before training, with less need to activate carbohydrate metabolism. Thus, the rate of production of acidic ions in the muscles is reduced, less lactate needs to be transconported out of the cells with these ions."



This is essentially how you are able to maintain speed (effort) over distance (time). Someone highly trained, elite or recreational, can run 26.2 miles at an 85% heart rate burning mostly fat.


....
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Last edited by westside; 06-11-2013 at 09:02 PM..
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:13 PM   #12
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I'm a believer in endurance first and then high intensity. Build up to 1 hour even more and then increase intensity, for shorter durations.

I've been coming back from a injury, lost a lot of fitness so I mix shorter runs will long rides on the bike and hiking in the hills. The bike ride might be 2-3 hours at around 65-70% HR; runs are usually a bit higher and I look for hills maintaining the full aerobic zone but the climbs build strength in my legs.

Last edited by westside; 06-11-2013 at 09:21 PM..
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:43 PM   #13
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Good answers as far as exercise advice, but how about some help for her issue of no energy on lc? I'm sure those with experience can pipe in.

My question would be if Cary is getting her vities? Drs. Eades do suggest taking potassium at each meal. ???

I don't think lc should be resulting in low energy - at least after the first few days known as lc flu so there must be some other issue going on.
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Old 06-12-2013, 07:22 PM   #14
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Hi daisyHair and congrats on your weight loss! I hear the frustration at your lack of energy in your tone, and I empathize with you.

I see you are on Atkins induction. (I have been too for exactly two weeks today, and I switched from a "low cal/low fat but still kept my carbs under 60 grams" style that I had been following since the end of March.)

Would you mind posting a couple of days of meals or maybe what a typical day would look like? Maybe there's something in your diet that we can identify that is making you feel so sluggish. Also, I'm curious - how would you describe your energy level before you started low carbing?

As far as exercise, I know this may sound corny but when I want to squeeze in cardio and don't feel motivated to do so, I line dance. Just You Tube it, and you're bound to find a few that you like. You get to stay inside and by the time you learn a new one, you kind of want to do it to the music well for a few rounds. For me, it's an easy way to stay moving continuously without stopping and it's only as strenuous as you make it.
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Old 06-17-2013, 03:47 PM   #15
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As far as exercise for weight/fat loss, i'm a firm believer that one has nothing to do with the other. So if it's just pounds and inches your looking to lose, then exercise is completely unnecessary. Mind you, I exercise regularly but it was for strength building not weight loss.
As for energy. Give yourself a chance to adapt to your new woe. If your body was used to quick carby surges then you may need some time.
I did, and it may be true for you as well.
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Old 06-19-2013, 07:45 AM   #16
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I might offend a few posters here but exercise should not be considered "optional" or at least if you are doing Atkins it's not. While it is not necessary for weight loss it is necessary for good health. Part of your sluggish feeling could be from the adaptation to ketosis but I would argue that it is in part to being sedentary as well.

There are many forms of exercise, find something that you enjoy and go do that. Hiking, running, cycling, swimming, group classes, dancing, you get the idea. If you are sitting around all day waiting for your energy levels and fitness to return you are likely going to be disappointed.

I was right were you are now 5 years ago, lamenting about being to big to run or take a fitness class. At some point I stopped thinking about it and just started doing it. I would be lying if I said it did not suck really bad at first but eventually it got easier. While the scale will likely ignore your fitness triumphs your vital organs will rejoice with each new victory.
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Old 06-19-2013, 10:46 AM   #17
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Cary, how are you doing now? I wonder if you have had specific tests recently on the health of your thyroid? I found myself with unusual fatigue several months back. It came on fairly slowly and low and behold, it was hypothyroidism. I was pretty surprised as I had the standard tests done just 1 yr. earlier.

On the exercise question, I do agree that it is essential for over all well being but, but but.... it needs to be done at a time and with a body that can do it. Anything else is risking physical injury and loathing that needs not be.

Exercise will happen because you feel like it and not the other way around. People do not remain sedentary because they are lazy ... they do so because it hurts to do otherwise.
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"The energy content of food (calories) matters, but it is less important than the metabolic effect of food on our body." Dr. P. Attia

"dumping carbohydrates on your broken metabolism is tantamount to doing jumping jacks on two broken legs" -The Spark of Reason

“Eat animals. Mostly fat. Enjoy!
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Old 06-19-2013, 08:52 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by batlou View Post
I might offend a few posters here but exercise should not be considered "optional" or at least if you are doing Atkins it's not. While it is not necessary for weight loss it is necessary for good health. Part of your sluggish feeling could be from the adaptation to ketosis but I would argue that it is in part to being sedentary as well.

There are many forms of exercise, find something that you enjoy and go do that. Hiking, running, cycling, swimming, group classes, dancing, you get the idea. If you are sitting around all day waiting for your energy levels and fitness to return you are likely going to be disappointed.

I was right were you are now 5 years ago, lamenting about being to big to run or take a fitness class. At some point I stopped thinking about it and just started doing it. I would be lying if I said it did not suck really bad at first but eventually it got easier. While the scale will likely ignore your fitness triumphs your vital organs will rejoice with each new victory.


I suggest you hire a trainer and get a Fitbit pedometer. I started with a trainer on 2/1/13 and my fitness level is better now than when I was a kid.... Yes, the first 6-8 weeks were torture... Yes it is high intensity cardio interval training and weight lifting... But a good trainer will assess your level of fitness and design a plan that will slowly get you in better shape.

I have a sedentary job too... You have to keep moving... Minimum of 10K steps per day... Take it slow, don't hurt yourself.... Your body will respond.
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Old 06-23-2013, 09:02 PM   #19
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daisyHair I am there with you in the not having energy to exercise! I just tell myself that if I walk 10 minutes today, that's 10 minutes of doing something to be more active, even if I'm not walking very fast.
I am so out of shape!
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Old 06-24-2013, 03:01 PM   #20
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daisyHair I am there with you in the not having energy to exercise! I just tell myself that if I walk 10 minutes today, that's 10 minutes of doing something to be more active, even if I'm not walking very fast.
I am so out of shape!
Awesome!
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