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Old 07-26-2014, 09:20 AM   #31
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Interesting discussion. I did the low fat vegan eating for a few years because I thought it was healthy and I am not too fond of meat. I believe it caused me to become pre-diabetic. Now I eat the LCHF and it seems to be working well. Its hard for me because I really don't like to eat meat that much but are so limited with other sources of protein. I do eat some tofu. I don't believe diabetes is every cured. I am a pre diabetic and really work at not becoming a diabetic but have to admit I really miss pasta and bread- hope someday that I will get over that. We'll see....
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Old 08-13-2014, 06:14 PM   #32
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Aomiel - does Dr Bernstein's diet allow for net carbs or total carbs?
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Old 08-14-2014, 08:48 PM   #33
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Please help

This is my first post. I don't know how to do this so I'll just see if this works. I just found out in June I have Type 2 diabetes. My doctor never gave me any instruction as to what to eat or who to see about this. She did give me a Metformin. I have since changed doctors and hoping this new doctor (which I haven't seen yet) will send me somewhere to find out what I should do. I have glanced through lots of books at the library and they all seem to say you can eat large amounts of carbs. I do not want to do this. Where can I find out about what this Dr Bernstein's diet is? Is there a book I can buy or a website I can go to where I can learn about this diet and what to eat? Also, since I am new here I don't know what all the LETTERS stand for. Hoping you can answer my questions. Thanks deedotb
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Old 08-15-2014, 05:34 AM   #34
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If you google: "Dr. Bernstein's Low-Carbohydrate Solution" you will find a lot of general about the plan.
He does have a lot of information on his site, but you may need to pick up the book for most of the details.
There do appear to be a lot of blogs dealing with his plan as well.
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Old 08-15-2014, 09:59 PM   #35
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Thank you

Thank you for the information. There are so many different opinions as to what you should eat, I really don't know what to do. I will try to get his book and see if it would be good for me. Thanks again
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Old 08-17-2014, 05:46 AM   #36
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Sorry folks, I've been on a 'surprise' vacation (he planned it. I was surprised) with my husband and we left the computer at home. I finally told him I couldn't stand it and we stopped and bough me an iPad Air.

So let me catch up...

Sarahat: No, I never eat fruit. Oh, I'm pretty sure that I can eat the occasional berries or lower carb fruits as a treat now that my A1c has been 4.9 or lower for more than a year *but*, to be honest, I'm afraid to get that taste back in my mouth. Through the years when dieting, I always looked at fruit as diet candy because it's so sweet. I'm afraid if I eat 'just a little' that it will lead to 'just a little' of something else. So I stick with Bernstein.

MagieDen: Bernstein calculates the protein at 1-1.5gm of protein per *kilo* of *ideal* weight. People with more muscle mass would need more protein. I do the 1gm because I'm a not very active woman (meaning lower muscle mass) although I know a couple men who do the 1gm and they have not lost muscle mass.

Shirlangel: Talk to your doctor about the Metformin ER. A lot of people who have problems with the regular Metformin, are ok with the ER version.

Ariadne: There are many 'opinions' on the best diet for diabetes. The fact is that it is the carbs that drive the insulin, and at some point we become insulin resistant which means even the smallest amount of carbs have an adverse effect on us. 'Experts' who say diabetes is cureable, do not understand the disease. It is absolutely not cureable but we can reverse the IR to the point of getting off all meds and controlling our BG's with just diet. I will *guarantee* you that if a diabetic goes back to the old high carb way of eating, they will (in time) be right back where they started. That means they were never 'cured' but were rather controlling it. Oh...by the way, I did follow a vegan diet *designed* for diabetics and, while I lost about 20 lbs, my BG's continued to climb. I'm not sold on that theory that it will control diabetes, but that's just my opinion and experience.

gotsomeold: Thanks for confirming my belief and motivating me not to give in that it's ok (now that my IR is reversed and have an A1c of 4.8) to go back to eating at least some carbs.

Leo: Gastric bypass doesn't 'cure' either. The severe diet and surgery create a honeymoon period of about a year for these people, but then the body adapts. We (in the nutrition/WLS counseling arena) are seeing many bypass patients (who refuse to follow the appropriate low carb WOE) gaining weight and going back on meds. Tragic given what they've done to their bodies.

ItsOverSugar: I believe he just counts total carbs as I do. *They* say fiber carbs don't count but they do if they are soluble fiber (vs insoluble) and most packages don't say how much is insoluble. I can eat my flax muffins and deduct the carbs for the flax because they're all insoluble. That doesn't work well with other things because a good portion of those fiber carbs are not insoluble. To be safe, I'd count all the carbs.

deedotb: Dr. Richard Berstein "The Diabetes Solution". While you can pick up some info on the net, I highly recommend getting the book. It's not that difficult of a read and I believe understanding *why* motivates us to keep on doing it. There is no doubt it will be good for you...if you can wrap your head around the fact that this is what you need to do.

I've been doing counseling for the last 20 odd years, mostly with abused women both in the regular community and Amish communities. About 10 years ago I decided to go back and get my CCN (certified clinical nutritionist). I mainly dealt with people with eating disorders as well as the abuse cases. Over the last year I've transitioned to mainly eating disorders and nutritional counseling. Easier to do when you've successfully controlled your own eating problems and health. Nothing inspires confidence less than a fat diabetic trying to give nutritional advice.

While the CCN background teaches there is no one perfect diet for everyone, I tend to approach most people with a low carb approach because I believe it benefits everyone. It's amazing how many people with fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue find that most (if not all) of their symptoms disappear when they follow Bernstein's approach. Anyway, I'm digressing but my health has improved so drastically over the last 20 months from strictly following Bernstein, that I'm pretty passionate about it.
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Old 08-17-2014, 07:13 AM   #37
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Thanks for starting this thread! I am a diabetic, almost 83 years old. My doctor seems to think it is okay to let me slide by with a BG of 250-350, prescribe lots of insulin - yet my BG stays in the same ranges. I'm going to start re-reading my Dr. Berstein's book and start immediately to control my BG! I also bought a copy of his book for my Kindle. It was suggested by a doctor in the ER.

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Old 08-17-2014, 07:23 AM   #38
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Thanks for starting this thread! I am a diabetic, almost 83 years old. My doctor seems to think it is okay to let me slide by with a BG of 250-350, prescribe lots of insulin - yet my BG stays in the same ranges. I'm going to start re-reading my Dr. Berstein's book and start immediately to control my BG! I also bought a copy of his book for my Kindle. It was suggested by a doctor in the ER.
That's great that you're taking control of your health, Joyce! Good luck to you.
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Old 08-18-2014, 05:07 AM   #39
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Doesn't Berstein say 6 for breakfast and 12 for lunch and dinner?
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Old 08-18-2014, 05:45 AM   #40
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Doesn't Berstein say 6 for breakfast and 12 for lunch and dinner?
On Page 181, a sample meal plan is:

Breakfast, 6g Carb, 3 ozs protein
Lunch, 12g Carb, 4 ozs. protein
Supper, 12g Carb, 5 ozs. protein

From what I think I've learned so far is that carbs should be kept at around 25 per day, and protein is customized for the individual's needs. I still have a lot of reading and studying to do before I personally have a set meal plan.


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Old 08-19-2014, 05:12 AM   #41
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Babsy,
Joyce is correct. Not sure where I got 25. For some reason I have it written down as 5 at breakfast and 10 at lunch and dinner. Will have to check my book out.
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Old 08-20-2014, 05:51 AM   #42
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Ordered Dr. Bernstein's book yesterday, looking forward to reading and learning how to have even better control over my Type 2 Diabetes.
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Old 08-20-2014, 06:26 AM   #43
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I started doing low carb after reading Atkins, 5 years ago. Without intending to, I eat about 4 carbs with breakfast, and 14 for lunch and dinner, so pretty close to the Bernstein plan, even if I use the food from Atkins. I was 361 lbs. and my A1C was over 10, but within 1 year my A1C was 6.2, and I was off my two 1000 mg Metformin, and Amaryl in the morning for high morning blood sugars. It took that long, only because my doctor was unsure if I would relapse, and start drinking Pepsi again. I had dozens of low blood sugars in that first year.

Today over 4 years since I stopped all diabetes meds, I have a 5.0 A1C, and have been below 5.4 for those four years.

Recently, I have been off plan, and gained weight, and will be tested soon, and expect a higher A1C, but I know how to correct both my blood sugars, and weight. I just have to do it, which is why I have returned to LCF.

I think it is possible for most diabetics to get off their meds, and have a normal A1C. LCHF is what works.
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Old 08-20-2014, 06:54 AM   #44
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I don't know why its taking the medical community so long to figure this out. The amount of misinformation given out to patients seeking to control their diabetes is frustrating. And when you try and follow a diabetic diet suggested from one of the many outdated resources that say to eat low fat and plenty of fruits and vegetables and wholebgrains , you can't stick to it because not only are you starving, but your blood sugar isn't stabilized which makes you more hungry. I could go on forever about this...hopefully the science will catch up with the practice of medicine. Remember guys most doctors are not vastly educated in nutrition. You are your best advocate.
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Old 08-21-2014, 05:01 AM   #45
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Unfortunately, I think the medical industry has just become proficient at throwing pills at an illness/disease rather than correcting the actual problem. Partly due to the fact that this is what their patients want. They'd rather take a pill because it allows them to continue the bad behavior and they're willing to settle for 'iffy' control...and you can talk yourself blue in the face trying to explain that years/decades of taking these medications take their own toll.
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Old 08-21-2014, 05:05 AM   #46
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:22 AM   #47
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Unfortunately, I think the medical industry has just become proficient at throwing pills at an illness/disease rather than correcting the actual problem. Partly due to the fact that this is what their patients want. They'd rather take a pill because it allows them to continue the bad behavior and they're willing to settle for 'iffy' control...and you can talk yourself blue in the face trying to explain that years/decades of taking these medications take their own toll.
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Old 08-21-2014, 11:37 AM   #48
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Was watching a youtube video this morning, and it noted that a 7.0 A1C, was an average of 170 mg/dl. Why would I want that to be my goal?

In that same video, the doctor besides Dr. Bernstein ( Dr. Wolpert ) actually said that the reason is that they don't want to get the patients hope up, and they are more concerned with low blood sugars.

It is easier to tell you to eat a bunch of carbs, and take pills/Insulin, knowing that you are NEVER going to experience a low blood sugar, than to feed you low carb, and have to teach you how to manage your blood sugars at the low end, and keep it above 70 mg/dl.

Basically it is laziness by doctors. Probably because if diabetes cause kidney failure, it isn't their kidneys. They would rather limit the damage, than get your blood sugars to a normal range. I found out that Bernstein thinks a 4.2-4.6 A1C is possible, and asked my doctor how he planned to get me down to that level, and he was speechless. On my own, with LCHF, I got it to 5.0, and off meds for 4 years.

At some point they will have to take notice that diabetics are fixing the problem, or greatly improving it, beyond what can happen with their " diabetic diet ", and make changes, but it won't happen anytime soon.

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Old 08-27-2014, 10:13 AM   #49
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Unfortunately, I think the medical industry has just become proficient at throwing pills at an illness/disease rather than correcting the actual problem. Partly due to the fact that this is what their patients want. They'd rather take a pill because it allows them to continue the bad behavior and they're willing to settle for 'iffy' control...and you can talk yourself blue in the face trying to explain that years/decades of taking these medications take their own toll.
Some do want "just a pill", that's true. But counseling people and working with them on lifestyle changes takes a LOT more time, and office appointments are shrinking smaller and smaller. I believe a lot of people could make enough changes in exercise, weight loss, and carb control if they had the right support.
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Old 08-28-2014, 07:25 AM   #50
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Some do want "just a pill", that's true. But counseling people and working with them on lifestyle changes takes a LOT more time, and office appointments are shrinking smaller and smaller. I believe a lot of people could make enough changes in exercise, weight loss, and carb control if they had the right support.
Medication should always be the last resort when dealing with type 2 and pre-diabetes (IMHO). Unfortunately for me, low carbing, being skinny and exercising my entire life did not stop my rising blood sugars after I reached menopause. I knew I needed help in the form of Metformin and my doctor agreed, and it's helping to keep my post meal blood sugars in the normal range.
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Old 08-28-2014, 10:33 AM   #51
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Medication should always be the last resort when dealing with type 2 and pre-diabetes (IMHO). Unfortunately for me, low carbing, being skinny and exercising my entire life did not stop my rising blood sugars after I reached menopause. I knew I needed help in the form of Metformin and my doctor agreed, and it's helping to keep my post meal blood sugars in the normal range.
I think it's a different situation when diabetes happens even thought you aren't overweight or exercising. You don't really have any lifestyle changes you can make, and it's you and your genetics. I'm glad you got medicated so you can avoid complications!
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Old 08-28-2014, 01:50 PM   #52
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Thanks, Celeste. I wish there was something else I could do instead of taking meds, but my genetics have been a challenge. High blood pressure, high cholesterol, a busted thyroid and now rising blood sugars. Hopefully, by continuing to watch my diet, exercising, not gaining weight and taking the Metformin, I can keep myself from developing full blown diabetes.
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Old 08-30-2014, 07:51 AM   #53
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Ronnie, I'm on so many meds that it could be depressing. But, they really do make my body work better. You are certainly on the right track to prevent and/or control diabetes. If you are having good lab results and feeling healthy, then just keep on doing what you are doing.

It would have been nice if my DH had taken diabetes seriously years ago. He's now had about 50 laser treatments on his eyes and been hospitalized several times with kidney failure. He now has Charcot foot with possible bone infections and is taking IV antibiotics in an effort to save his foot. He always took the medications, but without eating correctly, the damage set in. For some of us, we need both approaches to handle this disease.
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Old 08-30-2014, 08:17 AM   #54
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I'm very sorry to hear about your husband, lazy girl. My brother, who's had Type 2 for about 15 years now and has also had issues because of his diet, does not understand why I'm on Metformin when I don't have a diagnosis of diabetes. He said, "your sugar can stay where it is for the rest of your life! Why take this stuff?" I told him that if my A1c is high enough to be in prediabetes territory, that my sugars are high enough to be doing damage. He just shrugged his shoulders. Meanwhile, he's been having issues with his eyes and with pain in his feet. "Nuff said.
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Old 08-30-2014, 10:18 AM   #55
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Personally, other than the " diabetic diet ", the first treatment for my diabetes was pills. They never really explained it, or told me why i was doing anything, other than cut carbs about 25 %, and take these pills, and test. At first I did not even know what the numbers were, or what was a good number.

I remember at my diabetic 8 hour training session having subs ( just 1/2 a sub.. not too many carbs ), with chips, and a diet pop. Yum. NOT. I was listening to them tell me about how carbs spike blood sugars, and that is why we drop the % of carbs to 45-50 %. I asked " If they are still high, do we drop them in half again? ". Needless to say, I got yelled at.. shrieked at actually. I was a little shocked. It was a simple question. At the time, I had never heard of low carb, or Atkins, or Bernstein, and this was before Taubes, and all the new guys.

So I spent 7 years on the " diabetic diet ", and lost 3 teeth, and developed neuropathy in my right heel.

I happened upon Atkins book at the drugstore, and tried it a few times, and finally went all-in as of May 2009. Within a year, I was off all meds, and remain so.

My point is, most diabetic patients are never given the option to try low carb. They do not get told that you can get off all your meds, and have normal blood sugars.

What they are told is to eat 45-50 % carbs, exercise, aim for 7.0 A1C, and pray they don't go blind, lose a kidney, or foot. That is the current diabetic plan.

The statement that people want to just take a pill and continue eating high carb food may be true... but we have no idea if it is. That theory has never been tested. We give diabetics one option, and they follow it. If doctors gave them both options, and they chose the " diabetic diet " over a LCHF diet, it would be one thing.. but they aren't given the choice. They are unaware that there even is one.

If you or I give them that choice, sure, they may turn it down, but only because their doctor has adamantly stated there is but one treatment, and we are not doctors. It would take a lot of faith for a diabetic to trust the person online, over their doctor. Most people are just desperate, and give low carb a try, and are surprised at how well it works, or have a friend who did it. Otherwise they follow their doctor's advice.

The fault does not lie in the patients picking the wrong option. It is their doctors, who do not give them any other options. Patients have no choice to make. That is why they do not choose low carb.
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Old 08-31-2014, 03:18 AM   #56
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Oh, IMHO, everyone is really different.

I have a friend who told me, "Yes, LCHF really brought my BG down and I felt really good. But I really can't live without bread and cake. My doctor says he will start me on meds when my HbA1c rises a little higher. I'm going to wait for that...it shouldn't be long."

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Old 08-31-2014, 05:49 AM   #57
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A one-page article on "managing diabetes" is in the September issue of the "Costco Connection". It's written by a "board-certified family medicine physician", and basically says to keep your A1C below 7.0, your fasting blood sugars below 130, and your 2 hours post meal below 180.

She also says to watch your carbs, 45 grams per meal!

I was very fortunate to have a Dr. who suggested low carb and to read "why we get fat". That was all I needed to start my information search on the subject.

I still have friends who say "diabetics can eat fruit". In stead of arguing with them anymore I just respond with "I like to keep a tighter control on my blood sugars than what eating fruit will allow". When I say that fruit spikes my blood sugar too high, they ask "how do you know". So many aren't even aware that they can check for themselves what certain foods will do to their BS levels. Unfortunately there is a lot of mis-information out there.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:55 AM   #58
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what is everyones thoughts on being hypoglycemic? I believe that I may be hypoglycemic over hyperglycemic. Would low carb still be the solution?
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Old 09-04-2014, 08:26 AM   #59
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Thank all of you for this great information. Aomiel, I printed out the information you posted in the beginning. It is so helpful! I just have two questions, what does BPC stand for? You said that it will "quell that hunger, etc.".
Also, I know low carb is the answer, and I have ordered Dr. Bernstein's book. What I haven't heard anyone mention is whether we have to watch the fat content. I know on low carb, fat is considered good. I hate hearing everyone tout low-fat when we know that isn't healthy. What about for diabetics? How does that affect BG?
Thank you for all information!
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Old 09-04-2014, 12:32 PM   #60
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LaRae, BPC stands for Bullet Proof Coffee. Usually coffee with butter and or Coconut oil added in. Some use cream and sweetner also in it. I tried it and must not have made it right cause i didn't like it. I do drink several cups of coffee with lots of Half and Half in it through out the day and it fills me up.

Fat is your friend! No need to count fat content. Watch our for low-fat versions of anything, they are usually higher in sugars to replace the fat, which raises your blood sugars.

Low-carb, moderate protein, and high fat is the way to go. Dr. Bernstein will explain it all in his book. Happy reading!
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