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Old 06-04-2011, 08:11 AM   #1
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Ibuprofen DOES stall me

Here is what I found after I started losing after I stopped taking Ibuprofen. Which seems to back up what I thought might be my problem.
Pain, fever, and inflammation are promoted by the release in the body of chemicals called prostaglandins. Ibuprofen blocks the enzyme that makes prostaglandins (cyclooxygenase), resulting in lower levels of prostaglandins. As a consequence, inflammation, pain and fever are reduced.
Evening Primrose oil - is a direct, natural source of GLA an essential fatty acid critical in the production of prostaglandin's. In the body prostaglandin's help with the regulation of fat metabolism. They also support inflammatory response, the various hormones in the body, and the cardiovascular, central nervous, and immune systems

Scientists of the German Cancer Research Center (Deutsches Krebsforschungszentrum, DKFZ) have published an article in Science revealing that the COX-2 inflammation enzyme stimulates the formation of new brown fat tissue in mice. Brown fat tissue transforms energy into heat. Therefore, mice with increased COX-2 production have a higher energy consumption and are slimmer. On the basis of these results scientists might develop a novel weight loss method for pathogenic obesity.



Love handles, muffin tops and stomach tires -- white fat tissue forms the typical curves in the notorious problem areas to store energy. Exactly the opposite happens in brown fat tissue: Instead of being stored, energy gets transformed into heat. To the dismay of many people, adults have only small amounts of this energy burner. By contrast, babies and animals in hibernation have lots of it in their bodies where it serves for heat regulation.

Researchers know that external influences can stimulate the production of brown fat tissue in animals. If rodents are kept at low temperatures, clusters of brown fat cells form amid the white fat tissue. A DKFZ research team headed by Dr. Stephan Herzig, jointly with colleagues from Munich, Marburg, Frankfurt and Lausanne, has investigated the molecular causes of this phenomenon. They discovered that the production of the COX-2 inflammation enzyme is increased in white fat tissue of mice after exposure to cold temperatures. COX-2 is well known to scientists: It regulates the key step in the biosynthesis of prostaglandins -- inflammation-promoting hormones which are also responsible for activating pain.

"Our recent results prove that COX-2 and prostaglandins are crucial for the formation of new brown fat tissue and, thus, also for regulating body weight," said Stephan Herzig summarizing his data. Parallel to the increase in COX-2 production in white fat tissue, there is also a rising level of the protein which biochemically transforms energy into heat and is therefore considered the most important biomarker for brown fat cells. When the investigators switched off COX-2 in the white fat tissue, however, the typical appearance of brown fat cells could no longer be stimulated by the cold.

Even without using cold temperatures the scientists were able to stimulate the formation of brown fat cell clusters in white fat tissue by boosting the COX-2 production in mice using a molecular-biological trick. The body weight of these animals was 20 percent lower than that of normal animals. Even on a calorie-rich diet they did not put on weight.

Previous studies by researchers from Finland suggest that in humans, too, the activity, i.e. heat production of brown fat tissue can be stimulated by regular stays in the cold. Stephan Herzig now plans to investigate whether COX-2 also plays the biochemical key role here. Since the formation of brown fat cells can also be stimulated in the culture dish, Herzig sees a possibility for practical use of his results. His vision is to take white fat tissue from severely obese individuals, to stimulate the formation of brown fat cells using prostaglandins in the culture dish, and then transplant them back to the patient. Thus it would be possible to help people by boosting their energy metabolism and thus making weight loss easier. Scientists estimate that a small amount of about 50 grams of brown fat tissue would be sufficient to increase a person's energy metabolism by 20 percent. This would be equal to a reduction of body weight by 20 kilograms over a period of one year.

Clinical trials with cancer patients have already indirectly revealed that COX-2 has an influence on body weight. Thus, the body weight of patients suffering from severe cancer-related wasting stabilized due to COX-2 inhibiting drugs. But a number of common pain relievers also act by inhibiting COX-2. Does that mean that users have to accept weight gain as a side effect? Herzig has good news: "So far, we have found no evidence suggesting that one has to fear gaining weight from taking these drugs."
But it says nothing about trying to lose weight while on them and the way you lose on a low carb diet might be another factor also. Anyhow I think I found my own evidence now to find a pain reliever that does not block COX-2 is the next challenge. I am so happy that low carb is working for me again.

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Old 06-04-2011, 02:30 PM   #2
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Thank you for the info. You are not alone. I too believe ibuprofen has stalled my weight loss. I suffer from chronic headaches and take alot of pain killers. I have gone about 3 days with no ibuprofen and it has helped with the weight loss. Now if I could just get off the excedrin. Please let us know if you find a better pain reliever.
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Old 06-04-2011, 03:02 PM   #3
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Wow it never occurred to me that a pain reliever could have an effect on weight loss. I take several a day. I find that aspirin does nothing to alleviate back pain, and acetaminophen taken in too high of doses over too long a period of time can cause liver damage. Ibuprofen is the best pain reliever for my period pain and my back pain. This is frustrating!

I too would like to know if there are effective pain relievers that don't impact weight loss. Thanks for sharing the article, though I think personal experience is probably more informative, as it is hard to know if all the proper protocols have been followed in a scientific study. (It's funny, isn't it,that things you used to be able to count on, like scientists and researches following all the proper protocols, can't always be relied on any more?)
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Old 06-04-2011, 07:29 PM   #4
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Your welcome. I will continue to try to find something I can take and share the info if I do. Or maybe I can take it in a lower dose but for right now while I am losing I am not going to mess with it. I don't lose during my TOM anyhow so maybe I can take it then. I would like to ask the Dr but they will probably treat me like I am coo coo. When I was doing low carb before for years I got very in tune with my body and what certain things did to me. Dr's seem to discount people knowing their body and don't believe it unless they learned it in medical school.
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Old 06-07-2011, 08:36 AM   #5
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I guess if I am crying from the pain I need to take something. TOM is here and that always aggravates my hip and back problems. The pharmacist said that tylenol didnt not block COX as much as ibuprophen so I am trying that first. But if I continue in this unbareable pain I will break down and take ibuprophen at least till TOM is over.
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Old 06-07-2011, 05:09 PM   #6
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Sry Jello I'm confused. Did your pharmacist say Tylenol was or was not a blocker?
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Old 06-07-2011, 07:35 PM   #7
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It was Walgreens online chat and she said it was but not to the extent that NSAIDS are. From what I could find on the internet they are still researching why tylenol works and how. Are far as blocking COX it still does but not as well as the others.
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Old 06-07-2011, 07:39 PM   #8
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It douses fever. It blunts pain. But it is powerless against inflammation and clotting. Scientists have long wondered why acetaminophen � the active ingredient in Tylenol � can perform some, but not all, of the functions of aspirin and other similar drugs.

Now, Vanderbilt University Medical Center investigators have an answer. They report in the May 14 issue of the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences that acetaminophen works on the same target molecule as aspirin, but that its effectiveness depends on the cell type. In nerve cells, acetaminophen works well; in inflammatory cells and platelets, it is much less potent.

The findings could contribute to the design of better anti-inflammatory drugs, said the study�s lead author, Olivier Boutaud, Ph.D., research assistant professor of Pharmacology.

�We are always looking for the perfect drug � one that is doing what we want and that has no side effects,� Boutaud said. �We are far from that drug.�

While acetaminophen is a successful and widely used drug, it does have undesirable side effects. A single high dose of acetaminophen can be fatal. And chronic use of the drug in some patients can result in liver and kidney damage.

�It�s not a safe drug, and we didn�t know how it works,� Boutaud said. �We thought maybe if we know how it works, we can understand why it�s unsafe, and we can design a safer drug.�

Boutaud and colleagues Dr. David M. Aronoff, instructor in Medicine, and Dr. John A. Oates, Thomas F. Frist Professor of Medicine, set out to determine how acetaminophen works. They confirmed what the scientific community assumed was true � acetaminophen works, like aspirin and other non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs, by blocking the activity of the cyclooxygenase (COX) enzyme.

But acetaminophen works a little differently to block COX activity. Aspirin, ibuprofen, indomethacin, and other NSAIDs insert into the COX active site � like the wrong key being stuck into a lock. Because they are in the way, the COX enzyme cannot do its normal job of producing prostaglandins.

Acetaminophen doesn�t fit into the lock. Instead, it disrupts the activation of COX by another enzyme activity, a peroxidase, within the same protein. Because this activation is necessary for COX activity, the end effect of acetaminophen and other NSAIDs is the same.

Chemicals called peroxides, though, drive the activation of COX and can overcome the effect of acetaminophen. Because platelets and immune cells generate high levels of peroxides, Boutaud said, acetaminophen doesn�t work well in these cell types. Brain and endothelial cells that participate in fever and pain do not have high levels of peroxides, and acetaminophen is effective in these cells.

Boutaud and colleagues hope their research findings will pave the way toward a toxicity-free relative of acetaminophen.

�Acetaminophen is a very good drug for fever and pain � we aren�t necessarily trying to design a drug that works better than it does, but one that is free of the toxic side effects,� Boutaud said.
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Old 06-08-2011, 02:22 PM   #9
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Wow, Jello, thx for this info! It is very clear and easy to understand. I guess the gist of this is there is no perfect pain and inflammation reliever yet.

Even aspirin (which doesn't work that well for me) is a cox inhibitor. I've been just enduring my aches and pains for the last few days and surprise surprise, the scale started moving down. I guess I'll use heat/ice therapy instead.
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Old 06-08-2011, 08:20 PM   #10
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Awesome Kattbelly I am glad the information is helping you. I caved in and took ibuprofen today. I am on TOM and both my hips were out of place and the pain of that is always worse during this time. I needed to get the swelling down, I could barely stand to sit in my chair at work. I also iced it and went to the chiropractor. I did however only take 400 mg instead of my usual 800mg at a time.
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Old 06-09-2011, 12:56 AM   #11
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I hope you feel better soon. It sounds like your pain patterns are similar to mine. Hopefully this research results in a better pain reliever.

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Old 06-09-2011, 04:44 AM   #12
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I have thyroid disease , and a year ago I was laid up with my back . Chiro said to take Aleve , or ibuprofen for inflammation . I can't take either of em , I swell up ,go figure . It is supposed to be for inflammation. When I took them ,& I took a lot too, it messed with my labs . My tsh crept up and t4 went down , so I gained weight from it .I know it has some thing to do with the metabolism. I gained like 7 lbs in a month from it !
I try not to take any meds for pain unless it is absolutely necessary !
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Old 06-09-2011, 05:17 AM   #13
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Thanks Kattbelly and bradywine it is good to hear more info to back my theory up. That is interesting and sad that it messed your labs up. I hope as the weight comes off my pain issues lessen.
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:11 AM   #14
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That's my hope too Jello, I know many of my pain and inflammation issues will be lessened as I lose weight. (At least I sure hope so!)
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:46 AM   #15
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Ibuprofen is very hard on the kidneys and liver, too.
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Old 06-10-2011, 06:09 AM   #16
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I saw a dutch study last year that said people that take ibuprophen or alieve type medicines daily are at a much greater risk for a stroke or heart attack also.
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Old 06-10-2011, 06:49 AM   #17
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I just read this thread and find it very interesting! Thanks for sharing all of the above information about ibuprofen. I was on NSAIDs daily along with prednisone for my RA for quite a while. I only take Tylenol now when I need something. I've been reading about how turmeric, a natural spice, is great for inflammation and pain. It also has other health benefits. Many people just cook with it to help with their pain. I may give it a try.
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Old 06-10-2011, 07:52 AM   #18
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Star, From what it said it would be a good choice if you wanted a natural alternative but it still works the same way as in it blocks COX.

Turmeric's Benefits
Turmeric is an herbal remedy used in both traditional Chinese and Indian medicine. Practitioners recommend it as a general health tonic and to treat a number of different conditions. The biologically active ingredient, curcumin, is an anti-inflammatory compound that inhibits the activity of cyclooxygenase and other enzymes that cause inflammation, according to the Linus Pauling Institute at Oregon State University. Curcumin also removes free radicals, which are by-products of digestion that may harm cells by damaging DNA.

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The Evidence
A number of studies support use of turmeric or purified curcumin to inhibit Cox activity and suppress inflammation. In one report by Dr. V. Kuptniratsaikul et al published in the August 2009 "Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine," curcumin extract was as effective in treating patients with knee arthritis as ibuprofen. In another study, published in the December 1986 "International Journal of Clinical Pharmacology, Therapy, and Toxicology," Dr. R. Satoskar et al observed that curcumin reduced inflammation in patients recovering from surgery. Several clinical trials with curcumin are ongoing as of early 2011, including one at the University of California in which it is being evaluated as a potential treatment for rheumatoid arthritis.

Adding Bromelian
Bromelian is a natural enzyme purified from pineapples. According to Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center, bromelian may have anti-inflammatory activity due to its ability to reduce levels of prostaglandin, a compound that is increased by Cox activity and that causes inflammation. Bromelian may have an added benefit when taken along with turmeric or curcumin because it may increase the amount of curcumin absorbed by the digestive tract, according to the Nutritional Supplement Educational Centre.

Recommendations and Precautions
Turmeric and bromelian are available at most health food stores as capsules, and each may be taken two or three times daily. Although these herbs are generally considered safe, some people may develop an allergy to one or both. Avoid turmeric and bromelian if you take immuno-suppressive or blood-thinning drugs as some interactions are possible. Consult a doctor to determine if consuming one or both of these herbs is advisable for your condition.



Read more: How Do Turmeric & Bromelain Work As Cox Inhibitors? | LIVESTRONG.COM
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:42 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Jello Jiggler View Post
Star, From what it said it would be a good choice if you wanted a natural alternative but it still works the same way as in it blocks COX.

Turmeric's Benefits
Turmeric is an herbal remedy used in both traditional Chinese and Indian medicine. Practitioners recommend it as a general health tonic and to treat a number of different conditions. The biologically active ingredient, curcumin, is an anti-inflammatory compound that inhibits the activity of cyclooxygenase and other enzymes that cause inflammation, according to the Linus Pauling Institute at Oregon State University. Curcumin also removes free radicals, which are by-products of digestion that may harm cells by damaging DNA.

Pure Turmeric Supplements Buy 1 Get 2 Free! Natural Turmeric Extract. Hurry Get Free Shipping Puritan's Pride A to Z Search
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The Evidence
A number of studies support use of turmeric or purified curcumin to inhibit Cox activity and suppress inflammation. In one report by Dr. V. Kuptniratsaikul et al published in the August 2009 "Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine," curcumin extract was as effective in treating patients with knee arthritis as ibuprofen. In another study, published in the December 1986 "International Journal of Clinical Pharmacology, Therapy, and Toxicology," Dr. R. Satoskar et al observed that curcumin reduced inflammation in patients recovering from surgery. Several clinical trials with curcumin are ongoing as of early 2011, including one at the University of California in which it is being evaluated as a potential treatment for rheumatoid arthritis.

Adding Bromelian
Bromelian is a natural enzyme purified from pineapples. According to Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center, bromelian may have anti-inflammatory activity due to its ability to reduce levels of prostaglandin, a compound that is increased by Cox activity and that causes inflammation. Bromelian may have an added benefit when taken along with turmeric or curcumin because it may increase the amount of curcumin absorbed by the digestive tract, according to the Nutritional Supplement Educational Centre.

Recommendations and Precautions
Turmeric and bromelian are available at most health food stores as capsules, and each may be taken two or three times daily. Although these herbs are generally considered safe, some people may develop an allergy to one or both. Avoid turmeric and bromelian if you take immuno-suppressive or blood-thinning drugs as some interactions are possible. Consult a doctor to determine if consuming one or both of these herbs is advisable for your condition.



Read more: How Do Turmeric & Bromelain Work As Cox Inhibitors? | LIVESTRONG.COM
well, dang.. I guess that ones out Vodka??? j/k
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Old 06-10-2011, 09:50 AM   #20
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Actually alchohol does wonders for my TMJ pain but not very good for the liver, not to mention I swell up with about 6lbs of water weight when I drink
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Old 06-10-2011, 10:38 AM   #21
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Actually alchohol does wonders for my TMJ pain but not very good for the liver, not to mention I swell up with about 6lbs of water weight when I drink
I have TMJ also...ugh! I rarely drink, maybe a glass of wine on occasion. Antiinflammatory foods have helped a lot with my arthritic pain.
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Old 06-10-2011, 12:13 PM   #22
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Star I am curious what foods do you eat that help?
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:32 PM   #23
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Dang! I take turmeric as part of my anti-candida regimen. No wonder I've been struggling with weight loss! I do it every other week. 1 week I take turmeric and garlic every day, the next week I take oil of oregano and grapefruit seed extract. I discontinued my daily Advil this week and I started losing weight again. But, this is also the O of O and GSE week. I wonder if next week my weight will be stalled with the Turm. and Garlic? I'll let you know.
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:56 PM   #24
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Dang! I take turmeric as part of my anti-candida regimen. No wonder I've been struggling with weight loss! I do it every other week. 1 week I take turmeric and garlic every day, the next week I take oil of oregano and grapefruit seed extract. I discontinued my daily Advil this week and I started losing weight again. But, this is also the O of O and GSE week. I wonder if next week my weight will be stalled with the Turm. and Garlic? I'll let you know.


yeah i'll will be interested to here, thanks.
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Old 06-10-2011, 06:53 PM   #25
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Star I am curious what foods do you eat that help?
I guess I should start by talking about the foods I avoid. I avoid gluten and dairy. They are both very inflammatory. I've had less joint pain and swelling since eliminating that from my diet. I eat more green leafy vegetables. I used to only eat corn and potatoes as my vegetables :blush: Corn is also very inflammatory and cause an inflammatory reaction as are most nightshade vegetables such as potatoes, tomatoes, eggplants, etc. I don't have problems with nightshades though, but many people do. Eating more fish and taking fish oil has helped me too. I'm starting back on Atkins induction tomorrow, but I don't eat cheese or creams, anything containing dairy now. I hope this helps
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Old 06-10-2011, 06:56 PM   #26
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Dang! I take turmeric as part of my anti-candida regimen. No wonder I've been struggling with weight loss! I do it every other week. 1 week I take turmeric and garlic every day, the next week I take oil of oregano and grapefruit seed extract. I discontinued my daily Advil this week and I started losing weight again. But, this is also the O of O and GSE week. I wonder if next week my weight will be stalled with the Turm. and Garlic? I'll let you know.
That will be interesting to know, please keep us posted! I just did a candida cleanse with pills from Rainbow Light that I got at the health food store. I'll probably take another round next week
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Old 06-11-2011, 12:52 AM   #27
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I just bought a brand new bottle of the turmeric too! If it causes stalls, I guess I'll have to see if there is another anti-candida I can take. I've tried Coconut oil, which internally doesn't seem to do much, but I use it externally instead of lotion, and it seems to be good for my skin. I tried apple cider vinegar, but honestly I don't think it has any impact on my candida symptoms.

This is such a balancing act!
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Old 06-11-2011, 12:40 PM   #28
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I just bought a brand new bottle of the turmeric too! If it causes stalls, I guess I'll have to see if there is another anti-candida I can take. I've tried Coconut oil, which internally doesn't seem to do much, but I use it externally instead of lotion, and it seems to be good for my skin. I tried apple cider vinegar, but honestly I don't think it has any impact on my candida symptoms.

This is such a balancing act!
did you buy the ACV with the mother? The other kind will just make the candida grow. The lady at the health food store told me I wouldn't need all of that, that this candida cleanse is all I would need. The pills taste horrible but I down them really fast with lots of water There are a lot natural ingredients in this cleanse..
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Old 06-11-2011, 06:01 PM   #29
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: San Fran
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Yep, I buy Braggs. I still use it and assume it must provide some benefit. I make salad dressing with it, and stuff like that.

I just finished a month long cleanse, that started with a 5 day fast(!) and an intestinal cleanse, then each week you focused on different body systems, like the lymph, and the blood, etc. It really helped with a new resurgence I had with the candida, and now I'm continuing with diet control and herbal antifungals.
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Old 06-11-2011, 06:49 PM   #30
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Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Medford, NY, USA
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Stats: 175/168/135
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I am a migraine sufferer and I take Motrin or Tylenol in great qty. I also take Naproxin. I am having trouble losing and I wonder, now, if this is one of the reasons.

I did Dr.'s Eades "Cure for the Middle Aged Middle" which requires you to stop all pain meds you can and when I did that there was some weight loss. 8 lbs in two weeks. Not bad I guess. At the time I was not happy; considering that I was just living off of shakes for two weeks. But, perhaps it had more to do with giving up the stressors to the liver.

I will try to stop pain meds for two weeks, without changing anything else, and see if that helps move the scale or measuring tape.

Thanks for the idea. Although, if I get a migraine, all bets are off! LOL!
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I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me at once.-Jennifer Unlimited
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