Alcohol Problems

[CurveControl]

I will look psych myself up to start the day after Dad and DD leave. They have just said "the first week in January" so I don't have solid dates yet. I will ask DD what days she has off work for a better idea of the date. Trust this~ I will need a day to recover. If My Mother comes too (Please God NOOOO!) I may need up to a week of hard likker to recover!
There are good reasons we moved far from my family!

Not DD, I miss her like crazy and am trying to get her to transfer her credits and go to a college here, But she really wants to finish at SIUE, and feels the need to help my Dad deal with my Mom, who is nucking futs! I have told her that her gramma is unsaveable, But she won't leave the two of them to live in co-denial together.

[Mel7]

CC I know what you mean about MOTHER My mother hasnt been welcome in my house for the last 3 years because i invited her and it was just shambles............

there wasnt even enough wine in the house and i make my own so you know what i mean.

If you ever want to chat drop me a pm.

John the 1st of January is a monday,I think thats a good day what do you think?

[peanutte]

I can't promise anything but I am willing to try. I was actually looking at treatment centers today, but nothing aorund here is anything other than AA, and I will not define myself as helpless and diseased. That's just not something I am interested in doing. (No offense to those of you who find the Program to work for you--it takes different things for different people.)

I was so happy to see some new posts here. I need support right now and was feeling really alone.

[CurveControl]

Peanutte~ It wasn't for my Dad either, When he was dry~About 5-6 years I think. He has several drinks in the evening now, But when he first retired I think that Not Working+My Mom's issues were too much and he started drinking earlier, and earlier, Till he was Fall Down on a daily basis. Once he got dried out (Inpatient at that point, and only because his pancreas blew, Not by his choice) it was easier for him to deal with his drinking. He went to AA a couple of times, But it wasn't his thing. DH dosn't understand how I can drink at all after watching him Detox (It was horrible) but I just don't see me getting to where he was, KWIM? I think that MM seems more realistic, as I don't think of myself as diseased or helpless either.

I was just talking to DS(14) about the plan to do a 30 abstinence, But waiting until Jan, and he said "But Why? Why don't you just stop now?" I Don't want him to ever be asking himself that same question, because belive me it is ringing in my ears right now!

[Mel7]

Originally Posted by peanutte

I can't promise anything but I am willing to try. I was actually looking at treatment centers today, but nothing aorund here is anything other than AA,

Just asking but what is wrong with AA ?

My hubby used to go years ago and said it was great and i have a friend that her friend just started to go and loves it??

[Mel7]

Originally Posted by CurveControl

I was just talking to DS(14) about the plan to do a 30 abstinence, But waiting until Jan, and he said "But Why? Why don't you just stop now?" I Don't want him to ever be asking himself that same question, because belive me it is ringing in my ears right now!

Yep makes you think doesnt it?

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by Mel7

Just asking but what is wrong with AA ?

My hubby used to go years ago and said it was great and i have a friend that her friend just started to go and loves it??

My dad had a problem with the helpless stuff, and the God stuff. He is not a religious man (He says Agnostic), But AA ain't a place that agnostics or atheists are made welcome, from what he said about it, and what I got from reading the books they gave him to read.
Plus he isn't big on sharing emotions, and that bugged him.

[peanutte]

Nothing is wrong with AA, for those who find it to be a lifesaver. But it's been the prevailing model of chemical health treatment for over 70 years. There are other approaches, like Women for Sobriety, MM, Smart Recovery, and many others. Some people don't see the need to define themselves as an alcoholic once they've quit or begun moderating, any more than an occasional social smoker should be equated with a pack-a-day smoker or an ex-smoker. Harm Reduction is the philosophy I ascribe to, as introduced in the excellent book Over the Influence, and if it absolutely doesn't work for me, I will reconsider AA, but I don't like the black and white thinking and the dogma. I don't see why there should be only one way for people to change and overcome their problems with alcohol.

[Mel7]

Maybe its depending on the group because hubby didnt have any problems like your telling me.His brother aslo went and loved it.
I guess a person could go to a meeting and weed it out ?

Peanutte you seem pritty determaned maybe you can do it without a center? We will be here for you

[peanutte]

I think it varies from group to group--think of all the varieties of personality and experience. The meeting I used to go to back in the day )when I didn't even have a drinking problem, but it's a long story) was very blue-collar and male-dominated, and they basically told me to **** my fancy college girl mouth when I questioned anything. I grew up in a strict Evangelical Christian home and rigidity does not do me any favors.

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by Mel7

Maybe its depending on the group because hubby didnt have any problems like your telling me.His brother aslo went and loved it.
I guess a person could go to a meeting and weed it out ?

Peanutte you seem pritty determaned maybe you can do it without a center? We will be here for you

The whole premise of AA is God/Higherpower based. How could you do the 12 steps if you don't belive in God?

(I personally do, But he dosn't so it was an issue.)

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by peanutte

I think it varies from group to group--think of all the varieties of personality and experience. The meeting I used to go to back in the day )when I didn't even have a drinking problem, but it's a long story) was very blue-collar and male-dominated, and they basically told me to **** my fancy college girl mouth when I questioned anything. I grew up in a strict Evangelical Christian home and rigidity does not do me any favors.

Me either, But thats because I am very very NOT strict or rigid!

DH has a friend who says I make hippies look conservative! LOL

[peanutte]

Also, some people do not want to sit in a group and share their feelings, like you said. I don't think everybody benefits from that. Individual therapy might be more effective for some people.

Here's what I've been trying to do--ask myself why I want more when I want more. What, I'm not drunk enough yet? How stupid is that? Am I bored? Lonely? Stressed out? Nervous? Hungry? WHAT makes me go ahead and go poast the point I know is reasonable drinking.

[Annie'sdad]

Hey ladies. January 1 sounds good to me for a challenge.

About AA. I have had some experience with it myself. My problem with AA is that I don't believe that I'm an alcoholic. Having a few each night is not the same as alcoholism so why would I go to AA? I also have some issues with the philosophy. Anyway the vast majority of people who stop drinking do not go to AA meetings or use the 12 steps. Or so I've been told.

John

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by Annie'sdad

Hey ladies. January 1 sounds good to me for a challenge.

About AA. I have had some experience with it myself. My problem with AA is that I don't believe that I'm an alcoholic. Having a few each night is not the same as alcoholism so why would I go to AA? I also have some issues with the philosophy. Anyway the vast majority of people who stop drinking do not go to AA meetings or use the 12 steps. Or so I've been told.
John

That is true, it seems to be a "Will or Won't"
But there are 2 types of an alcoholic- One who cannot stop once they start, but can go days/weeks beteween drinks, and those who drink Daily, and get anxious or upset at the thought of No Alcohol at all in the house. We have both flavors in my family.


The criteria in the DSM-IV-TR

establish whether alcohol abuse or dependence is present. Criteria for alcohol abuse include 1 of the following in a 12-month period of time: failure to fulfill major role obligations, recurrent drinking in hazardous situations, recurrent legal problems due to alcohol, or continued use despite recurrent associated interpersonal or social problems. Criteria for alcohol dependence include 3 or more of the following in a 12-month period of time: tolerance to alcohol effects, withdrawal symptoms, impaired control, drinking more or longer than intended, neglect of activities, increased time spent drinking or recovering from drinking, or continued use despite recurrent psychological or physical problems

I don't think of myself as an alcoholic, But I sure fit the criteria!

[CurveControl]

Also- The issue that many-I have been reading-is that in AA a drink, a small slip, a sip of champagne at a wedding is the same in their eyes as a binge. Failure is failure.- So many times a relapsed AA member will go on a bender, because the attitude is. Like over eating, I screwed up, may as well enjoy it.

From what I am reading No Treatment is successful. Alcoholics almost always drink again.
The founder of MM killed 2 people years after she founded MM, But it still seems the way I want to go.

Another option, if all else fails, A a new drug called Vivitrex (google it)that blocks the pleasure center that alcohol stimulates. It is a short term (3 month) medical treatment, and follow up therapy is recommended, But it seems to have some very promising results.

[lisayak]

Originally Posted by CurveControl

The whole premise of AA is God/Higherpower based. How could you do the 12 steps if you don't belive in God?

(I personally do, But he dosn't so it was an issue.)

Easy - use the combined experience of the group. I know I live in the UK (VERY secular society here - "God" is viewed HIGHLY SUSPICIOUSLY) and I'm originally from New Jersey so I 'm most likely out of touch with AA in heartland America but I know many, many atheists here in Cardiff who have good recovery without a "God" based higher power. A heavy hand with the religious stuff would put me off too.

[lisayak]

Originally Posted by peanutte

I think it varies from group to group--think of all the varieties of personality and experience. The meeting I used to go to back in the day )when I didn't even have a drinking problem, but it's a long story) was very blue-collar and male-dominated, and they basically told me to **** my fancy college girl mouth when I questioned anything. I grew up in a strict Evangelical Christian home and rigidity does not do me any favors.

That is horrifying, and I am so sorry you had to experience that! How rude - and also very against AA Traditions. Shame on them!

[lisayak]

Originally Posted by Annie'sdad

Hey ladies. January 1 sounds good to me for a challenge.

About AA. I have had some experience with it myself. My problem with AA is that I don't believe that I'm an alcoholic. Having a few each night is not the same as alcoholism so why would I go to AA? I also have some issues with the philosophy. Anyway the vast majority of people who stop drinking do not go to AA meetings or use the 12 steps. Or so I've been told.

John

Gotta agree with you there, John - if you're not an alcoholic, there's no reason to be at AA!

Lots of ways to quit drinking. The important thing is doing what works for you!

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by lisayak

Easy - use the combined experience of the group. I know I live in the UK (VERY secular society here - "God" is viewed HIGHLY SUSPICIOUSLY) and I'm originally from New Jersey so I 'm most likely out of touch with AA in heartland America but I know many, many atheists here in Cardiff who have good recovery without a "God" based higher power. A heavy hand with the religious stuff would put me off too.

In AA? The 12 steps-

We admitted we were powerless over alcohol--that our lives had
become unmanageable.

Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.

Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.

Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.

Admitted to God, to ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.

Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.

Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.

Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.

Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.

Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.

Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.

Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

I guess one could subtitute 'The universe" for God.

[peanutte]

Could you make your non-drinking self your higher power, I wonder? Like, "the best part of me"?

The founder of MM killed 2 people years after she founded MM, But it still seems the way I want to go.

Yes, and she had decided that for herself, moderation wasn't possible, and she was striving for abstinance. I think she was attending AA at the end there.

The Harm Reduction philosophy rejects the premise that "once a problem drinker, always a problem drinker" and seeks to empower you to make incremental choices about your alcohol use. Friends and family might say "You're an addict! You have to go to AA and be sober!" But that's their script. No one knows the truth about your drinking more than you do. People want a big ABC Movie of the Week confrontation where they get to yell at you and make you cry, and then you're supposed to suffer and thank them later for saving your life. I grew up with an undisgnosed bipolar mom, and I've had enough drama in my life. No thanks.

What if you flip it around and say "You have permission to drink whatever and however much you want. Now, do you really want to do that? If so, why? What are you afraid of, that there won't be any more alcohol in the world tomorrow so you have to drink it tonight? How about you wait and make that decision again tomorrow?" That works sometimes with food issues, for me.

[Mel7]

Originally Posted by peanutte

Could you make your non-drinking self your higher power, I wonder? Like, "the best part of me"?

thats a great idea ! Its the same thing really just with a different name

[CurveControl]

Originally Posted by peanutte

I grew up with an undisgnosed bipolar mom, and I've had enough drama in my life. No thanks.

AMEN, Only My Mom had undiagnosed Lupus incduced psychosis~The ever changing psych patient! Now (after 20 years of freaky ness) she has been treated for lupus, But will only go to the doc if she has visible Sx (skin rash, peeling) but when it affects her brain (Like now) she is so paranoid/Psychotic she won't go. "I am NOT acting crazy!!"

Originally Posted by peanutte

What if you flip it around and say "You have permission to drink whatever and however much you want. Now, do you really want to do that? If so, why? What are you afraid of, that there won't be any more alcohol in the world tomorrow so you have to drink it tonight? How about you wait and make that decision again tomorrow?" That works sometimes with food issues, for me.

That is a great way to look at it.

[peanutte]

The reason I think this works is that sometimes the acquisition of the "fobidden" is really the beginning of the "high". Thinking about bingeing on junk food or fast food--you crave it, you obsess about it, you make that furtive trip to the drive-through and cradle your warm bag of food all the way home, get into your house and eat it in a daze.

[Mel7]

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/alcoholism

John i still fall into the